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  1. #221
    Originally Posted by VONNOWAK View Post
    Another way to randomize the location of your objects is to use this great Add-On - Animation Nodes :

    http://blenderartists.org/forum/show...nimation-Nodes

    Here is a Video with some examples. Reminds me of c4dīs mograph system:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnlUhlkxQZU

    and here:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pfh4J0Qpdjk

    Wow....very impressive! Didn't know about this.



  2. #222
    Member kayosIII's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Chris Offner View Post
    Thanks for both those comments.

    I didn't know you could make an already selected item the active one again simply by SHIFT+clicking it another time. That removes one annoying step in my previous run down but still leaves one additional unnecessary click compared to if the Copy Attributes add-on worked in a "from selected to active" way.
    There are two reasons for doing it the way it currently is:
    1) you can have one active object, but as many selected objects as you like. It's really handy to be able to copy that transform to more than one object at a time.
    2) The active object is the one you are going to see settings for anyway.

    [after a bit of editing and trying things out] It turns out that you only change the active object if you use the shift + click method of selecting so easiest current method I can think of is:

    1) select the source object
    2) use any method of selecting the destination objects other than clicking on it.
    (border select, circle select or lasso select).
    3) right click on a transform panel -> copy to selected.

    With the shift click select, I wonder how it would go if It changed the object to active only if the object was already selected.

    IE:
    shift click when no selection object becomes active and selected.
    otherwise if the object is not selected it becomes selected and if it is selected it becomes active.

    Can anybody think of an area of the application this would break terribly?
    Last edited by kayosIII; 05-Apr-16 at 11:15.



  3. #223
    Chris, awesome thread.
    edit: waiting for the interface customization vid!

    Originally Posted by Chris Offner View Post
    Aah, node-based procedural modelling workflows? Interesting - where can I read more about this development in Blender?
    Did you see Sverchok?
    http://nikitron.cc.ua/sverchok_en.html
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERvsccqn9sQ
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5SYNxykqtM
    github repo here: https://github.com/nortikin/sverchok/

    Originally Posted by Piotr Adamowicz View Post
    Like I said, the shortcuts don't require conscious thought either, they're muscle memory for me at this point
    +1, Blender's shortcut-centrism makes it really fast.
    Last edited by snsd; 07-Apr-16 at 06:14.



  4. #224
    Member DerpGoose's Avatar
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    Quite interesting. Never used Modo, had to learn 3DsMax, Maya and Softimage at Uni, really do not enjoy their workflows.



  5. #225
    Member Chris Offner's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by snsd View Post
    Chris, awesome thread.
    edit: waiting for the interface customization vid!
    Thanks, I'm glad you enjoy it!

    I'll definitely do a UI customisation video, it's on my list.
    The short version is:
    MODO has the most customisable UI although the workflow isn't as simple as it could be.
    Blender offers a lot of customisation possibilities and just dragging out new viewports and changing them to what you want is awesome. You cannot change which buttons are where and in what menu though (without coding of course), which in MODO you can.
    Maya is the least customisable in terms of UI. Not too much to say there. The new Hypershade in 2016 introduces some nice UI customisability but it remains to be seen if that will be expanded to the rest of Maya's UI.

    Originally Posted by DerpGoose View Post
    Quite interesting. Never used Modo, had to learn 3DsMax, Maya and Softimage at Uni, really do not enjoy their workflows.
    Not to step on anyone's feet but while I respect your opinion, I've always found otherwise unspecific "Maya sucks"/"Blender rocks"/"Maya has a better workflow"/"MODO's workflow is more/less enjoyable" statements to provide very little concrete value without meaningful details. I'd be happy to hear what specifically you found unenjoyable about their respective workflows.



  6. #226
    Meh. Since when is interface scripting coding? Yes, it's not idiot-friendly. Neither is CG in general, with any software. But to call Blender less customizable just because you customize it via some simple scripts instead of a GUI... I wouldn't go that far.



  7. #227
    Member Chris Offner's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Piotr Adamowicz View Post
    Meh. Since when is interface scripting coding? Yes, it's not idiot-friendly. Neither is CG in general, with any software. But to call Blender less customizable just because you customize it via some simple scripts instead of a GUI... I wouldn't go that far.
    Well, I would. I'm not afraid of scripting but many artists are - and I also prefer to do things via a (well-designed!) UI if possible. You may very well disagree but I do believe the majority of users shares my view on this.
    So if one software allows them to do the same task without having to script while Blender does require them to script, then they will perceive the former software as easier.



  8. #228
    Member DerpGoose's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Chris Offner View Post
    Not to step on anyone's feet but while I respect your opinion, I've always found otherwise unspecific "Maya sucks"/"Blender rocks"/"Maya has a better workflow"/"MODO's workflow is more/less enjoyable" statements to provide very little concrete value without meaningful details. I'd be happy to hear what specifically you found unenjoyable about their respective workflows.
    My major issue with those software packages is the bloated interface designs, especially for 3DsMax and Softimage, it always feels like I end up spending more time clicking on menus to get to features. Setting up render can also be a nightmare at times. Their scripting languages are limited as well, with Blender we have Python and access to the source code to customise Blender.

    The real-time environment allows for rapid visualisation and prototyping, even with the built game engine. Even real-time water physics can be done in the game engine, thanks to python.

    Rigging is a breeze on Blender and can even be further animated by capturing motion from even a webcam. UV unwrapping is quite good too, saves alot of time, and the textures can be painted directly and on the model and previewed in the view-port then baked out.

    The interface layout and mode switching is quite intuitive, quick access to the entire process without having new windows open up on the screen. Simple Ctrl, up, down, left, right.

    Quick access to tools by pressing space and just typing in what is needed, no need to go scroll down long lists in a clunky interface.

    Fast 3D viewport navigation with the numpad.

    Works on all operating systems, without the need for an install, is smaller in size and works on lower end hardware.

    Free to use, follows the open source philosophy, provides education for people from low income countries and households.

    Great for the scientific community to do analysis, visualisations, simulations and virtual experiments.

    Blender can do everything except for audio engineering, which most likely will come into the software in the future.

    There is a lot more praise I can give Blender, but life is short molecular illusion and I have no respect or time for corporate greed and their bought marketing hype. The world is slightly better because of open source software like Blender. The only reason why most studios use other packages is from years of conditioning in the schools. Monkeys can use tools without knowing, Sentient beings can see the bigger picture of reality and build tools to shape it. And Captain Morgan is great.



  9. #229
    Member Chris Offner's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by DerpGoose View Post
    The world is slightly better because of open source software like Blender.
    I fully agree!
    Originally Posted by DerpGoose View Post
    The only reason why most studios use other packages is from years of conditioning in the schools.
    Having Maya taught in most 3D curricula targeted at the entertainment industry contributes significantly to its market dominance, no doubt about that.
    Claiming that it is the only reason studios use Maya over Blender is grossly inaccurate though - and I believe you as well as other devoted Blender users also know that.

    I'm very much opposed to Autodesk and their business practices but find it important to not let these emotions (and these are topics I feel passionately about) cloud my judgement. Most importantly, I try to not automatically attribute stupidity to any opinion that differs from mine. You'll find that in the majority of cases, that's an unfair, inaccurate and most of all unhelpful way to approach different perspectives.

    Do you genuinely believe all the studios and artists creating the most amazing animation and VFX work in the world in Maya are all less than "sentient beings"? I'm sure you don't.

    Blender is an amazing piece of software, a fantastic project and community, but like any competitor it is not without its shortcomings.
    Personally I advise against simply dismissing the technical and design achievements of competing software just because you disapprove of their business practices. Instead, let's appreciate what each package can learn from others in the areas which others do better - because each of those packages has brilliant and passionate developers involved, no matter your opinion on the business side of those companies. From my own experiences, chances are the developers of those companies may share more views with you than they do with the business people heading their own companies.

    I fully expect that Blender is in the process of seeing a lot more uptake by studios and professionals, especially if the much needed 2.8 Workflow Project intended to make Blender more pipeline-friendly proves successful!
    Originally Posted by DerpGoose View Post
    Monkeys can use tools without knowing, Sentient beings can see the bigger picture of reality and build tools to shape it.
    Not that it matters here but the vegan in me compels me to point out that monkeys are also sentient beings and even use tools. :P

    Okay, I realise let myself get dragged in another meta discussion there, so lets cut it short here.
    Last edited by Chris Offner; 08-Apr-16 at 08:21.



  10. #230
    Member DerpGoose's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Chris Offner View Post
    I fully agree!

    Having Maya taught in most 3D curricula targeted at the entertainment industry contributes significantly to its market dominance, no doubt about that.
    Claiming that it is the only reason studios use Maya over Blender is grossly inaccurate though - and I believe you as well as other devoted Blender users also know that.

    I'm very much opposed to Autodesk and their business practices but find it important to not let these emotions (and these are topics I feel passionately about) cloud my judgement. Most importantly, I try to not automatically attribute stupidity to any opinion that differs from mine. You'll find that in the majority of cases, that's an unfair, inaccurate and most of all unhelpful way to approach different perspectives.

    Do you genuinely believe all the studios and artists creating the most amazing animation and VFX work in the world in Maya are all less than "sentient beings"? I'm sure you don't.

    Blender is an amazing piece of software, a fantastic project and community, but like any competitor it is not without its shortcomings.
    Personally I advise against simply dismissing the technical and design achievements of competing software just because you disapprove of their business practices. Instead, let's appreciate what each package can learn from others in the areas which others do better - because each of those packages has brilliant and passionate developers involved, no matter your opinion on the business side of those companies. From my own experiences, chances are the developers of those companies may share more views with you than they do with the business people heading their own companies.

    I fully expect that Blender is in the process of seeing a lot more uptake by studios and professionals, especially if the much needed 2.8 Workflow Project intended to make Blender more pipeline-friendly proves successful!Not that it matters here but the vegan in me compels me to point out that monkeys are also sentient beings and even use tools. :P

    Okay, I realise let myself get dragged in another meta discussion there, so lets cut it short here.
    You're right and I agree with you. There are a lot of great artists out there forced to stick to certain software. Blender has been used in some films like Spiderman 2 for example and Pixar also uses it. The monkeys commentary was aimed at the group that have been conditioned to the point that they really believe proprietary is the only good thing. You'll have to excuse my manners, it's what happens when the world allows an ex terrorist to come into power and runs the country down into violence and poverty. The niavety of some activists. But thanks for the vids, it was interesting to see it.



  11. #231
    Member Craig Jones's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Chris Offner View Post
    Well, I would. I'm not afraid of scripting but many artists are - and I also prefer to do things via a (well-designed!) UI if possible. You may very well disagree but I do believe the majority of users shares my view on this.
    So if one software allows them to do the same task without having to script while Blender does require them to script, then they will perceive the former software as easier.
    The Pie Editor addon costs $10 US and allows a user to customize almost anything they want into pies, menus, or pop ups in the UI. I know it isn't ship with Blender free, but it does exist as an alternative to the normal python scripting to customize aspect of Blender's ui. I bring this up because even though it costs, it is probably less costly than plugins for Modo and Maya (I suppose because I have no idea really).

    This pie editor addon exports pies as json lists that are like tags for the content used, but to use the pie you have to have the addon running since it doesn't export python files directly. I do understand you might only be concentrating on things in Blender as defaults or in contrib folder.

    I like the discussion, it is very enlightening since I don't have experience with the other 3d software.



  12. #232
    Member pitiwazou's Avatar
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    It's better to have everything great in the software, but knowing the code allows you to create your own tools and then be even faster.

    That's why I love blender, python is easy and we can do what we want, it's not so complicated and we can have a lot of help.

    If I knew, I will have learned code 10 years ago, it's not easy, but create your own tools is really great.
    With the widget system comming, that will be even better.

    A 3D artsit should absolutly learn code.



  13. #233
    Member Craig Jones's Avatar
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    Yes, a 3D artist should - but working with Illustrator in my day job has taught me that it is good to be able to figure out scripting, but it is also very convenient to have something like the Actions dialog that allows you to record and save your own steps like a macro without having to dig into the code. I think to have both is good, because I make use of scripts that others have made, a few of my own, and a lot of my own recorded actions saved as buttons.

    This is how I got into my latest attempt at learning python - I just wanted to automate my steps in blender for 2d painting in the 3d view, so I watched tutorials and talked to masters until I could get something working. I woudl still love a way to just press 'record' and make some actions, and then get it to play back. Small things woudl be good.



  14. #234
    Member pitiwazou's Avatar
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    In the pie menus Addon you have that, you make your actions, select the code and use it in the pie.

    Maybe the author could make an addon only for that, that allow you to create buttons in a panel for example.



  15. #235
    Member Craig Jones's Avatar
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    I do wish it were easier to access the history levels in the tool bar - that was something I thought would be easy to record as a macro by selecting the few steps made and replaying them It is possible to do something and repeat, just not when you undo - then you have to redo the steps since history is gone.



  16. #236
    Originally Posted by Chris Offner View Post
    Well, I would. I'm not afraid of scripting but many artists are - and I also prefer to do things via a (well-designed!) UI if possible. You may very well disagree but I do believe the majority of users shares my view on this.
    So if one software allows them to do the same task without having to script while Blender does require them to script, then they will perceive the former software as easier.
    Guess it depends on the metric you're using - "How easy is it to make a trivial change?" vs "How deeply can I change things?".



  17. #237
    Is fill region (CTRL + SHIFT + RMB) ( https://developer.blender.org/rB756a...953664171907d2 ) working for you in 2.77a?

    Select shortest path (CTRL + RMB) works for me, but CTRL + SHIFT + RMB only behaves like SHIFT + RMB.



  18. #238
    Member ideasman42's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by maegmaeg View Post
    Is fill region (CTRL + SHIFT + RMB) ( https://developer.blender.org/rB756a...953664171907d2 ) working for you in 2.77a?

    Select shortest path (CTRL + RMB) works for me, but CTRL + SHIFT + RMB only behaves like SHIFT + RMB.
    This change hasn't been in included in 2.77a.

    Note that some short comings were pointed out on this thread, since then its been rewritten and further improved:
    http://download.blender.org/ftp/idea...k-293-march-28

    Edge mode could use further improvements though, exactly how it should work isn't so well defined (maybe handy if it works similar to face but selects the region outline for example).
    Podcast * dotfiles * My Wiki * Blender/Stackexchange
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  19. #239
    Member Chris Offner's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by ideasman42 View Post
    Edge mode could use further improvements though, exactly how it should work isn't so well defined (maybe handy if it works similar to face but selects the region outline for example).
    Having it select the region outline when in edge mode sounds like a really good idea to me!



  20. #240
    Member Chris Offner's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Piotr Adamowicz View Post
    Guess it depends on the metric you're using - "How easy is it to make a trivial change?" vs "How deeply can I change things?".
    Agreed. My metric is the former - as that is what most non-technical 3D artists want to be able to do: make trivial changes to the UI in a quick and simple fashion without requiring technical understanding of the application.
    The latter is self-evident I believe; obviously an open-source application will allow you to make deeper changes than a closed-source application, provided you have the technical skillset.

    Example:
    In MODO there are two tools (Inset and Shift) that are entirely redundant because all of their respective functionality is covered inside the Polygon Bevel tool already. There's been discussion to remove them but at this point they're still part of MODO and their buttons clutter up the Polygon tab of the Modelling tools panel.
    Because I find them superfluous and absolutely never use them, I prefer my UI to not be cluttered up by them.
    MODO allows me to simply go into the Form Editor to visually edit any existing form (=UI panels and pie menus), as well as create new forms which can then be docked anywhere in your UI, all without any scripting. So I go to the Polygon tools tab form and remove the Inset and Shift buttons from my UI. Easy peasy lemon squeezy.
    Now the Form Editor in MODO could definitely use some significant usability improvements as it's still a lot more tedious to use than it could be, but it's already very useful to have.

    Here are two very quick tutorials on how to do custom forms and pie menus with MODO's Form Editor:


    They don't show the full power of the Form Editor, like how you can easily add icons, tooltips and help URLs to your buttons, apply styling (like turning them into boolean checkboxes where applicable) etc., but it's a nice quick overview.
    Last edited by Chris Offner; 11-Apr-16 at 09:36.



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