Haven’t seen or heard a lot about Sensei’s Alchemy here, but it looks to me (if I understand it correctly) that it may be a viable alternative to Substance Painter right inside Blender.
Anyone using it and can give an opinion?
In a first look I think that are very different tools
Is expensive, 60 USD when I can get painter in the summersales of steam for 90 , I’m really more interested in the pachupp solution https://blenderartists.org/forum/showthread.php?393277-PBR-Specular-shader-in-blenders-viewport , but I think he drop the develop till the 2.8 idk , also for this demos would be better to hire somebody to test than do by your own, the results don’t look so good but the tool seems nice
Bpainter seems more focused in handpainted textures and things like that and pixaflux have that node thing and don’t looks intuitive but have great paint tools with all the curve paint options and the procedural textures, all 3 are too far from substance painter, quixel or mari and mari is free for non comercial work, substance painter seems the best option if you buy that in the summersales or something like that, 170 is expensive to me but worth for 90, if you have photoshop quixel would be a great option for 80, and, even without all the default textures and materials that quixel or substance painter have, mari is great, if you are student or a hobbyist I’ll choose that, is free for you and industry standard
Apples and Oranges. 60 USD is not expensive for a non-trivial niche program that can be expected to sell maybe a few hundred copies tops. It might even be too cheap to be worth the effort. Developing for Blender has a huge opportunity cost - there’s more money to be made with less effort elsewhere.
That’s why Blender users are so uninteresting as a market. You can be small and profitable, or you can be large and cheap, but you can’t be small and cheap and still expect to be cared for.
60 USD is expensive when I can get a better option for almost the same money, and ofc when I can get a better option for free, is just the market, back in the days I’ve seen people selling half made render engines for much more than that 60USD but there was almost no free alternatives and people gladly pay for them, today you can’t sell that, you have Lux, yafaray, Mitsuba, you can even get a copy of Renderman non comercial, and ofc cycles, happens also with the game engines, you can’t sell a game engine when Unity and Unreal are giving away copies, but few years ago you could sell that , is the same fo all the texturing ADDONS that the blendermarket try to sell, they are expensive and can’t compete with other solutions that are industry standard because they aren’t in the same range, that’s JUST MY OPINION, save money and buy substance painter or get mari if you are hobbyist, that addons don’t cost 2/3 of what substance painter cost and ofc mari is a better option than that TO ME , if you want to pay that is your money
You’re comparing with a stand-alone program on discount, the regular price is 150$. It’s not integrated with Blender, which is one of the key selling points of this addon. Such a program can not be sold for less money and still be profitable. I understand that this addon isn’t worth it to you, but it’s not expensive by any sane economical measure.
I’ve seen people selling half made render engines for much more than that 60USD but there was almost no free alternatives and people gladly pay for them, today you can’t sell that, you have Lux, yafaray, Mitsuba, and you can even get a copy of Renderman non comercial, and ofc cycles…
People actually do pay for licenses for Vray, but also Corona Render or Indigo Render. Sure, it’s hard to compete on price with free, but you get what you pay for. Mitsuba is not being developed anymore, Luxrender and Yafaray barely are.
Anyway, you’re doing nothing but to reinforce the impression that Blender users are not worth dealing with as customers. All those freebies that you are getting from the likes of Unity or Unreal are effectively advertisement. Those companies can afford it, people developing for Blender users in particular can not. Go visit the Unity Asset Store or the Unreal Marketplace and then tell me that what you get there for 60 dollars is so much more valuable than what you get on Blendermarket.
…or get mari if you are hobbyist…
A real license for mari costs 60$ per month…
Apples and Oranges.
ofc all that is just my opinion, texturing addons, amateur render engines, amateur game engines. you can’t sell that, ofc there’s paid alternatives that still sell, you have a team to develop a game engine and want to try to compete with Unity, or you are a genius and you think you can do a better job than Arnold, go for it ,but try to compete with something that is over your range, with the only selling point that is integrated for almost the same price… you know that 80% if not more of the user base of blender are hobbyist just like unity or unreal, is just like try to sell an sculpt addon for blender for 150 when you have zbrush core for the same price
texturing addons… you can’t sell that
Yes, you can. Not to you, of course. Fortunately not everybody is willing to spend as little as you. Otherwise there would be no commercial development for Blender, at all. Don’t assume everybody has your requirements.
Pricing finding is tough, but the worst thing one could do is listen to people like you, who probably wouldn’t even spend 5$. To me, 60$ sounds like a fair price to pay, if this tool solved any problem I had.
try to compete with something that is over your range, with the only selling point that is integrated for almost the same price…
Integration is actually a pretty good selling point. You could probably charge 60$ just for better Substance Painter integration into Blender and make even more money.
you know that 80% if not more of the user base of blender are hobbyist
I’m willing to believe that 99% of Blender users are completely worthless in monetary terms. Those people don’t matter either way. I’m more concerned that the remaining 1% also might be too cheap for their own good.
I’m not against the market, sure could be things that can be monetized, but sell addons that do less than free programs just to have a little part of that program inside blender is not for me, assuming that I can or can not spend 20 30 or 50 Euros in something xD well I have paid for addons before if that’s what you are wondering, ofc you can think is just for the money but the real problem is that we alredy have a full program usually for the same price, sometimes even free that do that, you want to pay I told you before, is your money, you want to promote that, I’m ok with it, are you upset because I think that nowadays is a waste of effort try to sell addons that do the same things that free external programs do or try to sell addons that do less than full programs for the same price of that programs, sorry is what I think, sure you could try to sell an addon that do the same things that meshlab do, but I will think that will be better to download meshlab
They’re not really doing the same thing, though. Integration really does matter. External programs hurt iteration time. Jumping between programs is extremely exhausting.
Meshlab is a great example, it’s a program with tons of features that you’ll never ever use, but it lacks one crucial feature: UNDO. In terms of workflow, it’s an utter nightmare. If some addon came along that integrated even a fraction of that functionality within Blender, it could save you hours of work and tons of energy. It’s all about the added value.
Of course, if you never do professional work, if you don’t have deadlines, if you have infinite patience and energy, then there’s no way you’ll see that value. That’s fine, but then don’t assume everyone is like you and that it’s pointless to create these addons. It may well be unprofitable to create these addons, but that’s a different story.
I think you are confusing things, one thing is the oficial addons or the develop of new features and other the market, and don’t get me wrong some of the things of the market are great, and yes when you are working you want productivity but all inside blender is not the solution, compatibility betwen software is better to me, ofc if you work solo you maybe want all that you could need inside blender but if you work with more people with different software you usually want compatibility betwen programs, not to have 20% of the program that you need inside blender, if I think that for some things the market is not the best option and is better to save money and buy other thing instead, or wait for a discount and buy, don’t know why that could be a problem, is just my opinion, really don’t know why you take my coments like if were something personal against you
It’s a pretty common opinion, though. I think it’s damaging to the Blender ecosystem. Why should I not point out the flaws in it?
really don’t know why you take my coments like if were something personal against you
I am not.
It’s not about you or me in particular, it’s about the “archetypical” Blender user that is too cheap for their own good. I found that Andrew Price made a whole video about it the other day.
Is a thread where somebody ask if according to us that’s viable alternative to a dedicate texturing program, and I said no, is better to save money and buy the program instead, you could go to the autodesk forums and ask if maya or mudbox are good alternatives to zbrush for sculpting and you’ll get the same answer which will be no, save money and buy Zbrush , don’t know what have to do with the video of Andrew which is related to paid training, but ok whatever
Hmmm not exactly the direction I was hoping for in the thread but…
You can get Substance Painter, Designer, access to Substance Source and Share for a subscription of either $9.95/month (if you have an older version of the Indie license). or $19.90 a month. Hardly something that will break the bank…Frankly, I’m jumping back into CG Cookie for the year too as they have a Substance/Blender flow coming out within the next month or so.
Maybe for you, but that is entirely subjective. I go from Blender > Z-brush > Substance > Krita > Blender > UE4 and i love every second of it. Working with multiple program at the same time gives me an rush and it definitely makes me iterate faster and on multiple levels.
That is the generalist vs specialist dilemma. Why would i want to waste time using old slower workflows, when i could iterate faster and more in that time with a specialized software?
Regarding that Addon, it looks useful and i would buy it if i had 60$ to burn ( i don’t sadly), but it isn’t on the same level as Substance Painter.
If you want that procedural power of SP you gotta get SP, not even Mari has these AO/curvature driven procedural masks. Well there is an Addon for Mari which does what SP does, but its way more complex to set up and slower to use. And it doesn’t work with the NC version of Mari meaning you have to shell out 2000$ + whatever that addon costs.
Blender Sensei’s Alchemy might beat Substance in the discipline of hand-painting textures, since i found SP to be too clunky for that.
BUT lets wait for 2.8 and Eevee, i have a hunch there will come out some more useful texture painting tools then.
Regarding that Addon, it looks useful and i would buy it if i had 60$ to burn ( i don’t sadly)
Alright, please don’t take the following the wrong way (I don’t know you or your work, so it’s speculation).
- There might be a correlation between these two things
- Let your work speak for your workflow
I don’t know if you’re still in school, if you have clients at all, but this insight is very important: Performing a lot of work is not the same as getting a lot of work done.
In your workflow, there are four programs that have painting/sculpting tools. The more you use a tool, the more efficient you become. If you use four different tools, you’re likely to spread yourself so thin, you’ll never get really fast with any one of them.
Secondly, many details don’t ever matter. This is something artists need to be tortured into accepting. If your client doesn’t care, you shouldn’t care, because you could be earning more by spending less time (unless your client is foolish enough to pay by the hour).
[QUOTE=
In your workflow, there are four programs that have painting/sculpting tools. The more you use a tool, the more efficient you become. If you use four different tools, you’re likely to spread yourself so thin, you’ll never get really fast with any one of them.
Secondly, many details don’t ever matter. This is something artists need to be tortured into accepting. If your client doesn’t care, you shouldn’t care, because you could be earning more by spending less time (unless your client is foolish enough to pay by the hour).[/QUOTE]
On your first point: This is why I was interested in Alchemy. Getting a Substance Painter like workflow within Blender is very attractive to me.
As to your second point: I have just completed a set of murals for a client. The largest was a 16’ x 57’ image of a humpback whale and her calf. I used Substance Painter to generate the texture, height etc. maps. Detail was of immense importance. I just saw it installed for the first time last week and at the risk of blowing my own trumpet it looks very good. The detail is incredible and the client is very pleased.
Now, I have never done a mural that size before - may never again, but in this case details did matter and I am pretty sure I couldn’t have done such a good job without SP.