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  1. #41
    Member Felix_Kütt's Avatar
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    from 1995:
    https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/220...aaf7756857.pdf
    Under 4.2 in a list of 8 issues 6th item states:
    “Prefetching may fetch otherwise inaccessible instructions in Virtual 8086 mode.”

    So this might all be really old news...

    Originally Posted by BluePrintRandom View Post
    this is why open source hardware needs to be a thing.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OpenSPARC
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S1_Core
    Last edited by Felix_Kütt; 08-Jan-18 at 16:45.
    FunLinks: . . . . . . .



  2. #42
    Member Ace Dragon's Avatar
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    The biggest performance loss is to likely be seen by most users holding out on Windows 7 and Windows 8 on older machines (according to Microsoft)
    https://www.pcworld.com/article/3245...older-pcs.html

    Noticeable impact may also be felt in a few cases for Win10 users on older Intel chips (but not as bad), but the impact might be close to 0 for those on new chips with Windows 10.

    So if you're still clinging to 7 and want maximum performance, you may now have to make the decision to upgrade to Windows 10 or move to Linux.
    Sweet Dragon dreams, lovely Dragon kisses, gorgeous Dragon hugs. How sweet would life be to romp with Dragons, teasing you with their fire and you being in their games, perhaps they can even turn you into one as well.
    Adventures in Cycles; My official sketchbook



  3. #43
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    ^ yeah right...





    grow out of it already (ps... be aware that coming to conclusions without experience only makes you ignorant)



  4. #44
    Member Ace Dragon's Avatar
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    SSD performance (probably on Intel boards) is getting slammed according to some recent benchmarks
    https://www.techspot.com/article/155...ows/page3.html

    Slowdowns of 50 percent in some cases, that would be enough to make Ryzen systems superior.
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Also, Epic Games has taken a major hit to their ability to keep their game Fortnight running smoothly
    https://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/..._says_Epic.php

    On Techspot meanwhile, they report that the issue is not limited to CPU's, Nvidia is reporting that their GPU lineup suffers from the Spectre vulnerability as well.
    Last edited by Ace Dragon; 10-Jan-18 at 00:16.
    Sweet Dragon dreams, lovely Dragon kisses, gorgeous Dragon hugs. How sweet would life be to romp with Dragons, teasing you with their fire and you being in their games, perhaps they can even turn you into one as well.
    Adventures in Cycles; My official sketchbook



  5. #45
    Member LarryPhillips's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Ace Dragon View Post
    ... So if you're still clinging to 7 and want maximum performance, you may now have to make the decision to upgrade to Windows 10 or move to Linux.
    There's another option. Don't update and use other methods to minimize the security threat.

    -LP



  6. #46
    I have not seen any news about GPU hardware being vulnerable to Spectre/Meltdown. I expect the NVIDIA driver update is for the display driver to work around vulnerabilities in the CPU. For example sandboxed WebGL could be vulnerable to a bounds check bypass.

    GPUs don't even do branch prediction or try to support the level of memory protection that is expected from CPUs. GPU memory security is quite poor already, but that's another matter.



  7. #47
    Originally Posted by LarryPhillips View Post
    There's another option. Don't update and use other methods to minimize the security threat.

    -LP
    Yep be like me. simply format c:\ and recover clean os from the image when viruses overflow the system kek)



  8. #48
    Member William's Avatar
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    I'm on the latest MacOS which includes the patch to fix this. No noticeable or measurable slowdown, luckily. For whatever reason, MacOS seems to be able to avoid the performance penalty.
    Visit my website



  9. #49
    Member jrboddie1's Avatar
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    As noted above you need an OS patch AND a firmware patch from your computer supplier. In the case of home built rigs, that means the motherboard manufacturer. I am worried that my supplier (Gigabyte) will not get around to supporting my 2009 era board.



  10. #50
    Member jrboddie1's Avatar
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    If I understood correctly, yesterday, Microsoft suggested that some servers would be better off NOT being patched if they are being operated in a more controlled software environment.



  11. #51
    Originally Posted by William View Post
    I'm on the latest MacOS which includes the patch to fix this. No noticeable or measurable slowdown, luckily. For whatever reason, MacOS seems to be able to avoid the performance penalty.
    How recent is your Mac? Microsoft writes that they expect slowdowns for Haswell and earlier Intel CPUs, but only minimal impact for newer hardware.



  12. #52
    For Cycles rendering I didn't find any performance impact with either CPU or CUDA rendering on Ubuntu Linux with the latest updates (PTI fix for Meltdown only so far), which makes sense since there's not many system calls. If you want to find a performance impact you have to look at operations like .blend file read/write, measure the time it takes to load image textures, etc.

    I think Apple is being a bit deceptive with the benchmarks they mention in their press release. Geekbench is not going to be affected much, it's similar to Cycles, lots of computation with few system calls. But operations like compiling or microbenchmarks do seem to be affected.

    For end users I doubt any of the performance impact is very significant though. If my computer became 10% slower overall I doubt I would be able to tell without measuring.
    Last edited by brecht; 10-Jan-18 at 22:44.



  13. #53
    Member Ace Dragon's Avatar
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    Have you applied the BIOS update yet, benchmarks show the slowdown from that might be worse than the OS patch.

    Anyway, it does put a wrench into possibly upgrading to Coffee Lake, so it might be wiser to wait and upgrade to Ryzen+ instead (it may cause the single-thread performance gap to close significantly and leave the AMD chip with a clear multi-core advantage).
    Sweet Dragon dreams, lovely Dragon kisses, gorgeous Dragon hugs. How sweet would life be to romp with Dragons, teasing you with their fire and you being in their games, perhaps they can even turn you into one as well.
    Adventures in Cycles; My official sketchbook



  14. #54
    Member Herbert123's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Ace Dragon View Post
    SSD performance (probably on Intel boards) is getting slammed according to some recent benchmarks
    https://www.techspot.com/article/155...ows/page3.html

    Slowdowns of 50 percent in some cases, that would be enough to make Ryzen systems superior.
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------
    Yep, just benchmarked my (old) Revodrive with Crystal Disk Mark again. Used to be ~1200MB per second, now down to ~700MB per second. May be partly old age, but the difference is too great. Writing is abysmal at ~160MB per second.

    I should have tested this before the patch got applied, though.

    Rendering speed: no difference.
    /*----------------------------------------------------*/
    System: Win10 64bit - i7 [email protected], p6t Deluxe v1, 48gb (6x8gb RipjawsX), 1080GTX 8GB, Revodrive X2 240gb, e-mu 1820. Screens: 2 x Samsung s27a850ds 2560x1440, HP 1920x1200 in portrait mode



  15. #55
    What is the real truth here? Surely it's not in the hardware manufacturers interest to slow everything down so we all need to upgrade again.
    Charlie

    ArtRage for Art ¦ EnergyXT for Music ¦ Blender for 3D



  16. #56
    Member Ace Dragon's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Charlie View Post
    What is the real truth here? Surely it's not in the hardware manufacturers interest to slow everything down so we all need to upgrade again.
    This also affects Coffee Lake PC's (less so, but the SSD impact could still be a big deal). Even if planned obsolescence was a thing, Intel would be making an idiotic move to do it to PC's in use for only a few months (especially since we have no official information on Ice Lake).
    Sweet Dragon dreams, lovely Dragon kisses, gorgeous Dragon hugs. How sweet would life be to romp with Dragons, teasing you with their fire and you being in their games, perhaps they can even turn you into one as well.
    Adventures in Cycles; My official sketchbook



  17. #57
    From the reading, the intention is to prioritize handling the security problem, with any resulting performance impacts not allowed to delay the release. With that in place, they can then start working on a more elegant fix that reduces impacts on performance which will understandably take a bit longer.



  18. #58
    Member theoldghost's Avatar
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    2nd update Linux openSuse for ucode - intel. 1.2 MB. Nothing noticed in render time which wouldn't be simply a deviation of less then a second rendering on the CPU. And, that with a render time of 2:40. Nor, any noticeable difference in overall speed. Granny Porn still taking a hit which is no doubt the site.

    Ace for those of us not tech types could you explain the BIOS update since obviously I've just received the OS system updates from Linux. And, have always been leery of attempting to update the BIOS where shit can go South even through years ago I did exactly that several times.

    Not being a power user this could be much ado about nothing personally. I don't use a credit online and any sensitive info about my granddaughter resides on a flash drive. Hell, I don't even have a contact list in the e-mail program but rely on memory. So some miserable son' a bitch sitting in a hovel in the old Soviet Union would probably move on. That being said my children and grand kids don't live my existence and do shop online and conduct banking business on a damn computer. So I'm watching this thread with that in mind.

    And, one other thought. Did I not read somewhere the Net could be reset to take these bastards back to parade rest with respect to this hacking. Or, did that thought suddenly surface in my mind somehow. Regardless, following this thread with much interest.

    ///



  19. #59
    Member Ace Dragon's Avatar
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    If you have an older machine (or a machine from a vendor not known for automatic updates), you are unlikely to receive the BIOS update (as in most cases, they come from the motherboard manufacturer).
    Last edited by Fweeb; 12-Jan-18 at 09:35. Reason: Deleted off-topic comment
    Sweet Dragon dreams, lovely Dragon kisses, gorgeous Dragon hugs. How sweet would life be to romp with Dragons, teasing you with their fire and you being in their games, perhaps they can even turn you into one as well.
    Adventures in Cycles; My official sketchbook



  20. #60
    Member Ace Dragon's Avatar
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    Intel's BIOS update may have bugs that cause your machine to reboot at times.
    https://www.engadget.com/2018/01/12/...-of-their-own/

    As a result, Intel suggests that you hold off on their updates for now. This so far has not been a good year for Intel (especially with the big splash AMD made with Ryzen+ and Threadripper 2 at CES).
    Sweet Dragon dreams, lovely Dragon kisses, gorgeous Dragon hugs. How sweet would life be to romp with Dragons, teasing you with their fire and you being in their games, perhaps they can even turn you into one as well.
    Adventures in Cycles; My official sketchbook



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