i still think tht we should have standard values for the standard arch like lancet depress ect…
you put a name and pick it then you got it no trying to find what values to put by just the default value gives results
i think it is easier that way
but i’ll test some more and see what happen
i got to find tht URL for the vault
but as i said this is not a rib vault per say but it is a vault
Thanks
http://www.opendimension.org/blender_en/arch_pressure.php
check this vault explode it’s an amaxing show
may be if you get in toch with him he might share it’s coding for the vault ?
don’t know
Salutations
in general
at the beginning i had to do a lot of searches to find specs about arches
and you don’t find all the details necessarely in wikipedia
so i think this script should be able to allow noobies to
look a little in wikipedia and say find the lancet arch
go to the script select lancet and draw it and get something
pretty close to a lancet arch very fast and easy
at least that was my idea at the begining!
i still prefer to have on sellection per type of arch
i know it represent a little more repetition of coding but it makes
life so much easier for noobie and other too
wanting to do some classical arches
and it’s got be simple, user friendly ,fun
and fast - that’s how i like to use script
now i don’t think that peoples with no or little knowledge about classical
architecture will be willing to search for hours before finding lot’s of
details about arches so the easier and fastes way it is to use the script
if it is user friendly !
and in any case in 6 months are you going to remember what
a lancet or depressed or segmental arch is and what the parameters are ?
let me know what you think ?
about documentation
do we have to write some doc for this and gives
the general spec of the different arches?
i don’t have the PDF writer
but i can do some doc in txt file!
my English is not perfect but i can do a version
of the script and doc in french no problemo amigo!
3D models & profiles
3D models generated from a profile ?
do you think it is possible to generate from a profile a 3D model ?
i think it would be something even nicer to have
but it’s little bit more difficutlt ?
look at the picture for an example of a generated 3D mdel
for archivolt
ogive parameter
see Wiki doc
http://fr.wikisource.org/wiki/Dictionnaire_raisonné_de_l’architecture_française_du_XIe_au_XVIe_siècle_-_Tome_6,_Ogive
the ogive already included is what i would called
a general ogive and is required as a general one
but i still think we should have the other one
like lancet and depress which are modified ogive
but also very specific
other type of ogives
spitzer ogive for riffle bullet ,rocket noses design?
also check out other type of ogives for rockets
may be should be part of another script ?
this script should be mainly for classical architecture
and your right about one thing
when you begin to look at classical architecture
and all the details it’s fascinating and
a lot of the old design where done with very simple tool
i mean with tools like ruler - compas - rope
and they did buildings that are still in place a few hundred
year after their construction
today we are having problem designing and building something
that can last more that 25 years !
it is definitively an interesting script
Thanks
Presets for the ogive shape might be a good idea. But what presets would you like to see?
An example:
Documentation will have to wait till later, because things are changing way too much at the moment.
By the way I contacted Ari Häyrinen, who created the arch pressure simulation, and he told me he created the vaults manually, brick by brick. So that won’t help very much with the script (but the simulations do look very cool). He was interested in the script though and asked me to keep him updated.
So what did I implement today?
Version 0.12 (snapshot again)
Video:
And the code as .py file (it has become too long to copy and paste here).
I won’t have much time to code the coming days, so probably the next update will have to wait till Monday or Tuesday.
i’ll wait this weekend for other comments and suggestions
thre is no rush per say
that’s will give me time to think about it and hopefully come up with good ideas
but it’s beginning to look as a great tool
i’m trying to work on a script to make an ionic volute which is not easy
but i’m beginning to get the first results but it’s gone a take me probably the whole week to get the first results
is there any doc on the python instructions you are using
i’v never seens theses before
so i’d like to learn more about it
Salutations
& Thanks a lot
just to clairify my toghs on guide lines and their usefulness for arches
many times the stone have to follow the line going to the centers or centers
of the arch because it the way it was build and necessary to trasmit maximum force if i remember well too - so there is a ophysical reason for it too!
i copied a piece of text from a book on arches indicating this idea see pic from the book showing the lines going toward the center
now the only piece that i’m not certain if something can be done about it
is the fact that some arches use equal size and rectangular stones or bricks
and other use stones with top and bottom at angle toward the center see pic
give me what you think about this feature of arches!
i hope this gives the idea of what i meat for guide lines
it was definitively not for the fun of it there was a good reason behind it and the reality of real arches in the physcial world
see pic for more dwg details showing theses guidelines for stones or bricks
anyway right i’m working on math for the ellipse arch which is more difficult than i tough because of theses guide lines but i think i found a solution
i’ll try to come back this weekdend with a good script showing this idea i had
for constant arc width
have fun with arches in blender
Salutations
Square faces and angle faces should both be possible and a simple toggle button will suffice to switch between the two. First I’ll have to get the normal arcs working correctly though (I’ve discovered some mistakes in the current way I’m creating them).
Another thing I’m struggling with is that in most pictures all brick are the same size. This isn’t a problem when creating circular arches or ogives, but it is with the parabola shape (see image below).
Here are some of the things on my todo-list.
Things that would be cool, but on which I still need to do quite some research and thinking of how to integrate them.
I’m looking forward to what you come up with during the weekend. Good luck with the coding.
i wa doing some resume for arch and here is the beginning of this info
summurizing some of them
see pic’s
i would suggest to preppare most of the ogives type first and then may be think in terns of 3D which in some cases migh be more complicated than others
but definitively very interesting
now you seems to already have found a way to do constan arc lenght for some of the arches which is great
now if you do the guide lines i think this should be part of another object independant of the first one for the arch - the same is tru for object for stone whenever you do something 3D
after you can then select what you don’t want and get rid of it !
ill continue with this elliptical arch whihc is a pain in the neck because
of constant length arc which shoule use elliptical integral ect…
but i found another way of doing the same but much simplet hoefully
let you know this weekend
Saluations
these are fantastic but i would suggest that you make another script for theses guys
because it 's a lot more complicated to do
and take lot more space
you have ribbed bault - long tunnel vault with different design
roman did it a certain way then in gothic time it wa something else
i have lots of docs on this subject
but for the time being i would suggest to try to to the arches
and then after concentrate on the vaults and domes which is a totaly different ball game at all
i’m still have some work to try to get some rectangular or angle stones
for the ellipse it’s gone take me a day or 2 before completing this
task so patience please
about parabola stone edges i don’t see the problem
everything seems fine
the only thing is the width of the joint
is there a way to set this widht?
can you explain more what you find wrong?
salutations
:eek:
woooowoow!
It seems very very nice…
one building representing the apogee of the roman empire is the
Flavian Amphitheatre / Colosseum / Roman Coliseum .
see pic from wiki
you can see arches on the front of the building but also in all the inside major structure is based on arches to minimize the weight of the building
this is the biggest ever arena built by the roman and a good example of classical architecture with arches
the outside arches qty= 80 X 3 story = 240 arches plus all the other arches
inside there must be a total around 500 arches
i’m trying to built a scaled model of this building and should have something inside 2 weeks
happy blendering
Salutations
this building has aorund 700 arches total
i began doing some of the arches on the outside wall going inside
now the inside arches as shone in pic uses thing plate stones
but very difficult to manually do the joint and be symetrical
the most difficult part being to center stone the key stone wich is falt in the middle
where i had to manuaaly split it in 2 then re-join after
mirroring the other half
hope the script will help with this situtation
note that the arche on front of building are using larger stones for the arch contour
Salutations
Here’s a quick message to say that I’m still alive and well. I don’t have much time, but I’ve continued work on the script.
Currently I’m working on getting all the arches right first. I’ll post again when I’m done with this.
RickyBlender: :eek: that’s an impressive task you’ve got ahead of you, good luck.
i got the script for constant arc lenght for ellipse see pic
but still needs some help with one or 2 problems for edges !
Salutations
i got to complete the ellipse with constant atrc lenght
see pic
now i got to seprarate theses guid elines from the ellipse itself and get the arc edges in
now the algorithm i used i valid for any parametric equations of whateve curve it represent whihc i good
the only problem is the way it’s calculating - it’s very long don’t know
why it takes a few seconds to do that wiht let say around 72 radius may be python is not that fast ?
note: sorry the first pic is not the one i wanted fir this ellipse
Saluations
not certain how to make it fit properly
mind you i can do the one for the three centered arches
but this one is missing something in the tet and it does not fit ?
unless this is only an approximate method and does not gie
a precise ellipse! see last pic
see pic
i tried to translate the english demonstration but may be my english is not good enough see the text in pic!
the last pic show the difference between a square cross dome
and also a 5 cross vault system - i mean there are losts of different
the last one is kind of a rib vault type
because of the central rib in each dome
type of domes in the medieval times
how they did it is quit amazing !
Salutations
I tried to recreate what they did in paragraph 90, but I ran into the same problem as you did (see image below). When following the steps, LN isn’t the same length as LF, so it’s impossible to draw a circle that has LF as a segment and N as centre. It is possible to draw the big circle though (the one with M as centre).
However why are you trying to replicate this method? Even if it is possible to get it to work, it sounds like a very difficult job to translate it to a script. The method in paragraph 89 does work (see inset in image below), and is much easier to code.
Now I don’t know how you created the second image you posted on Nov 28th, but that looks pretty good to me as well. Were there any specific problems with that one, besides speed? If not, you might want to post the code for it and I’ll see what I can do to speed it up.
By the way, the images of the vaults look great. Oh well, time to continue work on the arches script. goes back to coding
Keep it up guys, looking good!
as such we use the exact polar equation for the ellipse so no i’m not looking for an equation to do a new ellipse script
this is only another method to get to do an ellipse in the field when you work
like it was done 500 years ago or more
i like to study old document showing how things where done in roman and medieval time - that’s the ways of old classical architecture
i need to do the old ellipse to see ho\w the Rome colleseum was done
in the field - in roman time the PC did not exist !
i’ll try to find more data about this later
hey but thanks anyway for trying it - so i know that i did not miss interpret the data in the book because my english is far from being perfect! LOL
guess for the speed thing
when debugging the loop i put some print inside to see the values while the loop was going on and that’s probably the reasons because when you execute a print the OS system limits the quantity of print you can do per second function of the printer specs like speed ect i think that’s the problem unless your are using a printer spooler program where the datas is accumulated and then printed later on
i continue with my script for th ellipse with constant arc for the Rome colesseum
it is a chalenging model to place all the columns and the arc sections which follows the radius of the ellipse - not an easy nodel at all to do in blender
blender does have much tools to deal with ellipse path and their radius
Thanks & Salutations
the script i’m working on is a general one in the sense that it can be applied to any type of curves defines with parameters
i use the ellipse equations and got more precision
but may be i should try to dinf an equivalent to the arc equations
see pic
ithe first pic is for an increment of 0.002 radians
the second one is for 0.0001 radians
naturally the snaller the angle the closer the sum for the arc is precise for the arch lenght
but not certain i thsis is a pratical equations because it seems to requires
a very small angle to get it
it s beginning to work but it still a little bit too large
the last radius should be before the 90 degrees angle !
Salutations