Blender development cycle

Support Basics & Interface
#1

I’m so excited that blender has gone this far, catching up commercial softwares features faster than any other softwares. It is relieving perhaps someday Blender will even surpasses the most advanced and widely used commercial 3D softwares in the term of features (heck blender got some features way before others). Sure, this is very exciting for any free software enthusiast, but at some points it is bothering me aswell.

I prefer Blender to be a solid, super stable softwares rather than bloated with unnecessary features. Just see what happens to Max, 2 dynamics simulation tool (havok’s reactor and the old crappy dynamic engine), 2 cloth simulation tool (clothFX modifier and reactor), 2 character animation (character studio and bones), about dozens of particle objects which almost all are identical, those are naming the frequent features I use in Max. Thus making max becoming very unstable compared to XSI or perhaps even Maya.

In linux, look at KDE (no offence for KDE fans) At some points it’s nice to have those features you can play with endlessly, experimenting with them cool effects and stuffs. But at some points I came to think how many resources it must load before I really can work with it. Then eventually I become bored, all I need is a solid window but easy to access window manager, so I turn myself to fluxbox.

So the point is, long release cycle is very fine for me, I’m very sure it’s fine for everyone. Slowly but sure. Kill ALL the bugs first if necessary, then add features later. IMHO stability is what makes FOSS distinctive from any other softwares. Just see Linux VS Windows battle and the “BSOD” term. And Blender would be a very strong candidate for the major market holder for 3D FOSS. I just don’t want it become ruined by bloatness.

I can’t release myself from commercial softwares yet, since I work on a company and in a team which uses Max and now they ask me to move to XSI. But when I feel prepared to start on my own, I would dump all commercial softwares I’ve been worked with, replaced my workstation OS with Linux and throw in Blender, GIMP, Jahshaka and Cinelerra. I have faith in FOSS now.

That’s my opinion, what u guys think?

#2

Kill ALL the bugs first if necessary, then add features later.

We kill all (most) of the bugs we know about. If users don’t report them - then they don’t get killed. If you want bug free releases it is the users responsibility to try the RC builds and report bugs that they find.

We had an RC1 and an RC2 build and numerous testing builds, as far as I’m aware you didn’t report a single bug to the bug tracker.

So the point is, long release cycle is very fine for me, I’m very sure it’s fine for everyone.

Well you would be wrong :slight_smile: A long release cycle is pretty much irrelevant to how many bugs are killed. Bugs are only killed if they are found, and bugs are only found if people actually use the software.

I just don’t want it become ruined by bloatness.

And what ‘bloatness’ do you see ‘ruining’ blender?

LetterRip

#3

i agree with some of the points made by you, lycanthrope, but also i think blender doesn’t have this bloatedness or many bugs (i dont think i have ever encountered a bug.) except, of course with new features in the testing builds.

#4

That’s about what I mean, with releases came up in less than half year or less, how can user find insignificant, minor bugs with that kind of very short time gap between releases? At least, to my opinion, let us experience it for a little longer.

As for bloatness, I don’t say blender is bloated now, but looking at blender releases, I see that most of the releases would likely came up with new features. Also being user friendly usually, although not always, means being bloated.

For example, but take this as my personal opinions only, the UI changes from 2.25 to 2.3x series. It’s nice, pretty to look at but also almost unnecessary. I prefer dull looking but fully functional to its fullest.

Another comparison example to get the picture, Knoppix and Slax. Knoppix is good for linux newcomer, since they can try all the gnu softwares it contains. While slax only provides one for each application, but they’re used to its fullest, thus it’s more compact and simple. I’m a slax kind of guy.

And as I said before in Max, there’re alot of tools that are very similar to one another, which left most of them being a parasite left just for compatibility reasons.

My point is don’t take commercial software footsteps by throwing all the features in just to please everyone.

#5

Bloat? The largest I have ever seen Blender get was apporx. 10-11mb and that was with Documentation and demo files.

Bugs? I have been lucky sort of, I never had a bug that was bad enough to make me uninstall Blender(All versions are online, so maybe I should either burn them on CD or uninstall a few versions…I still love the old Producer version though)

I better get outta here before I start “over” babbling :slight_smile:

#6

ok I’m here not trying to be a troll or starting a flame war, just sharing my thoughts and suggestions on blender. It’s okay to discuss these stuffs even though maybe alot of you don’t agree with me, specially on the bloatness thingy, right?

#7

That’s about what I mean, with releases came up in less than half year or less, how can user find insignificant, minor bugs with that kind of very short time gap between releases? At least, to my opinion, let us experience it for a little longer.

I guess I don’t see how this helps you at all. If the insignificant bug is in the newer rellease then you would still find it and could report it then. The vast majority of code doesn’t change at all each release, so a bug found in 2.37a could be fixed in 2.42. Indeed about six bugs that existed in releases before 2.25 were fixed in 2.40. Of course new code will always have bugs, but you generally don’t have to use the new features.

If you like you can stick with 2.37a for years, noone is forcing you to upgrade. Then you can read the logs from however many releases you skipped and pretend it all happened in one release.

Or you apparently liked 2.25 - why not stick with it then? Free doesn’t mean you have to upgrade to the latest and greatest version just because it has come out.

You are worried about a theoretical possibility of bloat - if bloat actually occurs then feel free to point it out, but complaining in advance seems a bit silly.

You apparently are worried about a theoretically possibility of Blender becoming unstable or being buggy - if it becomes so - then file bug reports and complain.

We almost certainly are not going to slow down the release cycle. Ton plans to release every two to three months or so.

While one month is a bit short (it was originally going to be just a bug fix and matching previous functionality release for the GE and python), 3 months is just about right.

LetterRip

#8

Ok, I was kinda surprised that I just downloaded the 2.4 release not long ago then this morning when I checked the website 2.41 already come out with new features. Just thought prevention is better than curing the disease :D. Again, don’t take this as an attack for the project, it’s just suggestion. I fave blender. :slight_smile: