Critiques and Stuff

General Forums Off-topic Chat
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Am I the only one who finds this scenario a bit odd/annoying?

Several times now, I’ve worked on an image for a while, while updating it in Works In Progress. If people have a few critiques/suggestions that they add, great! I might as well get as many of those out of the way while I’m still working on the image before I post it in Focused Critique.

Once I’ve finished the image by my standards, and done everything with it that I personally think needs to be done, I post it in the Focused Critique section to see what other people have to say about it. I’ve always hoped to get a lot of critiques, as pretty much every critique I’ve received is valuable information that’s useful for not only the image I’ve submitted, but for future renders as well.

Well, this is all great, but often I only get a few critiques, and not much more. So after sometimes bumping the thread to see what happens, but no no avail, I think, “Hm; well, I guess I’ll post it in Finished Projects, then. I’m happy with it, and apparently no one else has anything to say about it”.

So I post my newly “finished” image in the Finished Projects section, and all of a sudden, critiques pour in left and right! Whoa! Where did these come from?! And more importantly, where were they when I needed them? Sure, most of those people give the image a compliment as well, but it seems like “Finished Projects” is the new “Focused Critique”. What’s with that?

This isn’t to say that critiques aren’t helpful after a certain point; they’re always useful, no matter how far along the image is. It’s just kind of disappointing to expect critiques in Focused Critique, not receive any, then get loads of comments in Finished Projects that are mostly critiques themselves.

I hope this post doesn’t come off as overly critical; come to think of it, I don’t like it when people post “critiques” in the Off-Topic Chat section, too! ( :stuck_out_tongue: ) I’m just wondering why it is this way. Why is it that most of the people who critique images spend their time writing critiques in the Finished Projects section? It all seems backwards to me…

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For sure, I’ve seen this happen too. It really is too bad, but I don’t know what can be done about it.

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So I post my newly “finished” image in the Finished Projects section, and all of a sudden, critiques pour in left and right! Whoa! Where did these come from?! And more importantly, where were they when I needed them? Sure, most of those people give the image a compliment as well, but it seems like “Finished Projects” is the new “Focused Critique”. What’s with that?

I had a thread about something like that. I made an alien and put it in finished projects.
The critiques poured in and I was like, "I put it in finished projects, I didn’t ask for critiques, " and everyone got all defensive.
I completely understand where you are coming from. That’s why I don’t really post anything here. Because people seem to critique only in Finished projects and not really in other places.

In my opinion, if you put it in finished projects, no one should critique it unless you asked for it. It’s your project, if you say it’s finished, it’s finished.

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The way I see it it’s quite easy, seeing over the years, people are lazy. But that’s just half the truth, people also got better things to do with their time, and many who are actually able to deliver good critique and help simply don’t have the time, or need to earn a living.

WIP is clear, people just lurk there, usually only enthusiasts post there.

Focused Critique means dedication. If you critique or suggest one thing there, the OP usually expects you to walk him through the improvements. On one hand ppl want to help, on the other most receiving critique there are not willing to improve by digging into the matter themselves.
If you say, add an environmental texture for more realistic lighting and mirrors it starts “mirror? equirectangular? how do I add the texture? what is this setting, what is that setting? where to get a free texture? why is this not working? why don’t you help me?”
So, it’s not only other people not critiquing, it’s many new Blenderheads trying to abuse FC for personal tutoring, scaring people away, simply because we’re not assholes and don’t just want to ditch someone we gave advise to… solution? To stay out of FC.

Well then Finished Projects is awesome, you tell people what they should’ve done better or differently. No strings attached. Take it or leave it, make it better next time or don’t.

Well, that’s me for you. YMMV. I’d love to have all the time at my hand to help out everyone in FC, but I can’t. And I spent a lot of time there, tryint to help Blenderheads out, just to see them abandon the whole project, or never see them again, because the realize it’s not for them or too hard a task. Might have been a nice experience for the other, but in the end he just wasted my time.
Doesn’t happen in finished artwork. The user has done his share, shown he can and want to do it. So, leave some constructive C&C there. I, and I guess no one else expects the user to change the finished artwork, just to give some nice advice for the next work, to improve upon, or to do better if in a similar situation.

In the end there are is lot of good practice stuff for certain situation, and you could very well write a book of “Design Patterns” for CG. There’s just stuff you do or don’t in certain situations.

Well. my 2 cents.

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Jonathan L, yeah, I wish something could be done about it, but I’m not sure what either. Oh, this is way off-topic (then again, this is “Off-Topic Chat”), but did you notice that we have the same number of posts on BlenderArtists? Well, not any more now because of this post, but I just found it interesting. Okay. I’m done pointing out random coincidences now :stuck_out_tongue:

McThingy, that’s what I’ve always thought, too. I see some images in Finished Projects where people have posted their new images, and they’re getting all sorts of critiques. I must admit that sometimes, I comment on an image in there just to give their image a compliment that isn’t a critique.

arexma, I can definitely see that. I never really thought about that before; it definitely requires more commitment in Focused Critique. As for your one paragraph towards the end, it seems like the image should be relatively close to finished by the time it reaches Focused Critique, if more people utilized the “Works In Progress” section, but like you said before, people just lurk there for the most part, so it’s not much help then, either…

Ah, well. Thanks for the responses, everyone! They’ve helped clear things up a bit for me.

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IMO focused critique is redundant between WIP and Finished Artwork…

If I am working on it I post it in WIP, there I get C&C to improve upon until it’s cool for Finished Artwork.
If it’s finished I post it in Finished Artwork, where I get C&C again from ppl not following the WIP, and I can take it to heart for the next project, or choose to ignore it.

Why would anyone post in focused critique?

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To me the difference between focused critique and WIP; WIP is when I want to drive what I am working on, i.e. the product. Focused Critique is when I want to drive my effort, i.e. my education. I expect WIP to be more “docile” and more of an exchange. I expect to get “decimated” in focused critique. WIP is candy-coated honesty where focused critique is brutal honesty.

I dunno, guess that’s how I see it.

Just to touch on why the focused critique gets less attention is that people take the work and opinions too seriously and nobody on either side of that wants the hassle for it. It all comes down to handling and giving HONEST critique RESPONSIBLY, but that can be hard to gauge as it’s impossible to know every one on the forum boards, so it becomes a risk.

P.S.

I’ve often wondered this too. Can be good to see how people react to ones work, but can sometimes be rude too. Is what it is I guess.

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I don’t think people should critique a WIP. Because its a work in progress. It’s not supposed to look perfect… it’s a work in progress! Usually in a WIP they are asking you how it looks so far, not asking for a critique. And again, unless they ask for it, or ask for help, people really shouldn’t give their opinions. Like Quandtum said, these critiques can sometimes be too rude.

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I thought before the “Focused Critique” section, Works in Progress was made for Works in Progress and critiques? I’m not 100% sure about this, but I thought that was the way it was before… Personally, that makes more sense to me, as when I’m posting updates in Works in Progress, I look forward to any critiques I may receive. I don’t really see the point in Works in Progress if people don’t want critiques. Then people are limited to either complimenting the image, or not commenting at all, which, coincidentally, seems to be the expectation of the “Finished Projects” section, only WIP is… well, a work in progress, not a “finished” image.

I think CGSociety has it right in that their section is both Works in Progress and Critiques, but apparently, not enough people thought that on BlenderArtists since the “Focused Critique” section was created in the end, and separated from the “Works In Progress” category.

I personally feel like critiques should have been spoken in Works In Progress, because if all you want people to say are things like, “It looks good so far!” Or “Great job!” It seems kind of pointless to me, as these compliments can be received in the “Finished Projects” section, only then the image will be complete.

But all that’s just my opinion.

IMO focused critique is redundant between WIP and Finished Artwork…

If I am working on it I post it in WIP, there I get C&C to improve upon until it’s cool for Finished Artwork.

I totally agree with that, arexma; I feel like Focused Critique and WIP should be the same section. It makes more sense to me, but again, it must not have been the most popular option for there to be two separate sections…

Just to touch on why the focused critique gets less attention is that people take the work and opinions too seriously and nobody on either side of that wants the hassle for it. It all comes down to handling and giving HONEST critique RESPONSIBLY, but that can be hard to gauge as it’s impossible to know every one on the forum boards, so it becomes a risk.

Yeah; that makes sense, Quandtum. At the same time, it seems like that could happen just as easily in the WIP section, but maybe not…

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Art is never finished only abandoned.