For Modo user switching to Blender 2.8


(cgCody) #61

I remember all the exciting buzz when the Lightwave team branched off and created Modo. It seemed so revolutionary at the time, though I never had the need to look closer at it.

That said, it’s interesting to see so many people jumping ship at once. Has Modo development really stagnated or did they go the Autodesk route of license rental?


(SaintHaven) #62

Its a bit of stagnation with a loss of smart development and design. When it was Luxology, a lot of the design decisions were smart and well thought out. The moment Foundry came in, Modo felt like it lost its focus. Some areas never really got the attention it needed, such as the sculpting and painting features. It just doesn’t feel like its designed with the same mentality anymore. The new licensing also sucks, and the community to developer interactions are all but lost (unless you have special access elsewhere).

Blender has far more momentum going for it, and the third party plugins are a lot better than what we are seeing on the Modo end. In short Blender lively, where as Modo feels forgotten. Maybe thats just me though.


(ByteC) #63

cgCody,

I love to work with modo. Running versions till V10 is hasslefree. I have paid for 11 and 12, having a maintenance contract running till 04/2019 which I will no longer renew. Modo itself seems to be pretty stable, the community is very helpful and polite, and hey, they have a cool blender thread over there.

As of now, you might buy a license, a maintenance contract or go subscription. But this is not the problem here. My notebook has natively 3 network cards, 2xRJ45 and one wifi module. I have to use VPN connections from time to time, e.g. when staying in a hotel and using the local wlan. Even on a perpetual license, modo wants to check every 30 days if you are allowed to start. If perpetual, there should be a one time check, because it is perpetual… Here the check fails every time.Spoken to their tech support many times, for my situation there is no land in sight…

This brings me to three conclusions…

A) pirates can use modo/mari w/o limitations. No way for me (I develop software/hardware as well, hard work…) This solution sucks, I’m always paying for software to support good work.

B) F management has shaved our right to run our paid perpetual licenses whereever and whenever, with or without an available internet connection since version 11. A no-go in the long run for me, it harms the paying customers. Counterproductive F, think about it!
And… who knows, what the pea counters over at companies like F or A have planned to shear us customer sheeps the next time…

C) It is not the price tag of blender, why i switch over to Blender… Blender won’t be adobandized like Mixamo / (maybe) Adobegorithmic at any time due to the open source and license model. Some sort of safe harbour for B users. Here we can support developers without having the fear, that the software will vaporize / be abandoned like other applications.


(cgCody) #64

@SaintHaven Man, and I thought all the Modo folks were drinking the Koolaid and singing their praise, but I guess I didn’t think about the Luxology to Foundry transition.

@ByteC I’ve been there before with over zealous piracy protection. Almost makes you want to go back to the days of license dongles, ey? Haha


(ByteC) #65

Hehe nope… and for a good reason. Some of my customers (spreaded all over the world), are producing daily newspapers. Some of the dongles we have shipped were damaged over the years. Of course there were limited replacement dongles shipped by default. I don’t want put more pressure/stress on our customers shoulders, so we have decided to remove the protection system last year.

Best copy protection on the long run: good work, good service, reliability, satisfied customers.


(William) #66

This is a very good point. Lots of paid software punishes the honest customers the most. Putting all sorts of arbitrary restrictions on your paid customers ends up incentivising piracy. Pirated software doesn’t have any license restrictions, obviously.

With Adobe, for example, if you own more than two machines, it’s a real hassle to use, because they restrict one license to only cover two installs. and you need an internet connection often, for it to phone home to check the license. I don’t particularly mind paying a fair price for software, but I should get a better product than if I were to pirate, not worse.

Other paid software, such as Final Cut, handle this much more gracefully. There are no restrictions, no subscriptions, no internet connection required, no hassle. Software houses really need to be careful that they don’t push customers away and incentivise piracy by putting the biggest burden on the honest paying customers.


(Metin Seven) #67

I totally agree. As a paying customer you shouldn’t be bothered by protection measures. I remember 3ds Max could be quite a hassle to authorize, back when I was still a 3ds Max user, before I discovered the heavenly bliss of Blender. :slightly_smiling_face:


(kkar) #68

Plus, Adobe likes to watch everything you do in their apps in the name of improving products. Paying customers also loose their privacy, in the name of visible and invisible telemetry.


(John) #69

I’m new (very new) to blender from modo! I have been a dedicated Modo user since 103 and have relied on the app professionally alongside maya in that time period, but with Blender 2.8 I’m finally trying to make a switch / skill transfer. My reasoning is that with 2.8, Blender feels as though it has hit a critical mass in terms of community and its thriving addon ecosystem. It has also addressed some of the UI weirdness that constantly put me off every time I checked in with the app. Cycles looks fantastic as does Eevee and the fact that it is free is just icing on the cake. Seeing some of the addons and exploring customization of the UI really makes me feel as though it can come close to modo as far as modeling. The passionate development surrounding it is very exciting when compared to what feels like stagnant or slowing growth in modos development. Modo is starting to feel like it might get left behind the way Lightwave was.

I was also compelled to give it another try when I saw that heavypoly / Vaughan Ling made the switch and using his config was my entry point - which was useful to me because he was coming from a modo-mindset.

I am still getting up to speed with Blender and I still tend to bounce between the two apps but there are a few things I find myself missing from Modo.

I miss the ability to use the sculpting tools (explicitly the soft-move tool) on regular mesh in edit mode. I am constantly using that soft brush in modo to nudge things around (bound to alt-T). Even a tool like modos ctrl-T would be useful to me in blender - proportional editing just doesn’t feel great to me because it requires that you already have a component selected. Modos soft-move tools are fantastic.

I do miss the workplane occasionally - that addon for Blender posted upthread looks cool!

Action Centers - in modo I have these bound to ctrl-shift-space and I am constantly moving between them. I’m still trying to understand how to do something similar in blender.

I miss modos topology tools. Retopoflow looks awesome but doesn’t seem to be ready for 2.8. I tried to retopologize in 2.8 based on some tutorials but it felt clunky and I ended up back in modo. I’ll keep thinking about it though.

Generally I find a lot of Blenders modeling features to be MORE intuitive than modo - little things like the way bevel works (mentioned upthread) are just smart but to me the addons really make the app what it is.


(Thinking Polygons) #70

Exactly. I do that a lot in C4D too.
To me this is one of the big flaws about blender’s design, there’s no unification of the tools/editors, it has far too many separate editors for no reason. It feels a lot more like several separate apps running on the same window. :frowning:


(kkar) #71

Well, not the exact way but the edit mode toggle remembers the last mode you are in. So you are in sculpt mode, then you tab back to edit mode. If you need need to do quick sculpting, then press tab to get into the sculpt mode right away and when done, toggle back to edit.

Proportional mode does not require any tool to be enabled actually. Make sure you set “release confirms” selected in prefs. Then you can drag verts/faces/edges casually (with proportional if enabled), called tweak mode and it was there even before Modo had it. But they messed that up in 2.80 unfortunately :frowning: Now it is a modal thing, so you have to be in that mode to do that. That was a total blow in my view, total set back and not a progress whatsoever, because that change really slows down modeling in 2.80 :frowning: I think they were all drunk when they implemented that. However it is still there, just requires additonal steps.

For action centers, see my addon made that for that purpose, posted above already.

@ThinkingPolygons

Actually it is not like Blender is all over with different things going on. That is called modal design. Blender has modes, what you are experiencing is moving between those spaces.

That is similar to never ending war between VIm and Emacs warriors which probably will go on until the end of time.


(Ace Dragon) #72

The modal system of picking a tool, using it, and then dropping it is what the industry at large is used to doing supposedly. There are numerous cases where what is ‘standard and familiar’ is actually slower.

If you don’t like that system, you can just have ‘select’ as the active tool and use the hotkeys and/or the menus.


(kkar) #73

However you want to skin it is fine, it was a working functionality which was part of Blender for many many years that was removed from Blender at the end of the day.

The reason I mentioned it because the poster was wondering about a certain issue about tweak like editing, and accessing the tweak mode with proportional is not as obvious in 2.8 anymore.


(Thinking Polygons) #74

Yeah, which is bad and very limited. :slight_smile:


(kkar) #75

I totally get that, I am a Vim (the eternal text editor) user so I am perfectly fine with it. But that rubs some other the wrong way for sure.


(Zimlorog) #76

I think the modal operators are fine, what bums me out is that I can’t change some of the hotkeys associated with the actions. For example, Bevel has a Profile option mapped to P. Well, P is really far away from where my hand naturally rests, but I can’t change it because it’s currently hard-coded (I hope they open it up!).


(Shiv0r) #77

Yeah thats basically my problem,too. I key maped all modals that i could find to confirm with spacebar similar like in modo to drop a tool. But inset and bevel modals are hardcoded for some reason that leads to inconsistency for me because i need to confirm it everytime with left click.


#78

I was one of the first people to buy Zbrush
I was one of the first people to pirate Zbrush

The pirate version was more stable , go figure :smiley:

Buggy copy protection is nothing new , its quite common actually

I have been a member in #emacs the official chat channel of emacs for years, I have only heard praise about vim. I never remember one claiming that Vim sucks. Emacs has a vim mode for crying out loud. Spacemacs which is a variant of emacs inspired by Vim is extremely popular too among emacs users.

The rivalry is a joke, like is the rivalry between DC and Marvel fans. Both are amazing in their own way.

Of course we always get the occasional trolls, but this is the kind of people looking for a fight and have no clue what they are talking about.


(apoclypse) #79

Nano for life!


(kkar) #80

Sure noone is getting a real fight over but the fundemental differences between how these apps operates naturally creates the divide, and I generally feel like this Vim/Emacs is the most pure form of why someone like Modo and hates Blender or the other way around, they are just different in ways that are not reconcilable sometimes.

That is one of my defaults on terminal, but it does not work well under Mc due to Ctrl-O :slight_smile: