George bush ain't the leader of the free world

i was just watching tv and they were talking about the president of the USofA being the “leader of the free world”

why do they claim they are the free world?

as far as i know i’m free and i don’t live in the US
George bush isn’t my leader (thank god for that).

saying that i’m the leader of the free world is just as acurate as saying he’s the leader of the free world.

i just don’t understand it !!!

actualy i think i’m more free than the average United States citizen.
i don’t need to fear getting sued because somone falls over.
i don’t need to worry about getting shot at school.
i don’t evenreally need to worry about guns.
walking at night isn’t a problem.
hitch hikeing isn’t a worry.
sleeping in the bush. don’t need to worry about animals, spiders, snakes, mosquitoes, actually the only thing in the bush to kill me is the cold or wettness
don’t need to worry about air travel.
don’t have any nukes (he he don’t even let them into our water)

to me that seems to be freedom.

if i’m wrong please fill me in.

this post isn’t suposed to be anti US or anything

But i do think that if George Bush was the leader of the free world (e.g. all democratic nations) it would be the dumbest free world ever!!!

i mean who almost kills himself with a pretzil.
you must admit he ain’t no Einstein.

I’m from Texas and I think I want to become a Canadian…

i don’t need to worry about getting shot at school.

If you are so much more free, then what prevents another free person from choosing to shoot you at school?

i don’t evenreally need to worry about guns.

Many people think the same thing, until it hits home.

walking at night isn’t a problem

Neither is it here. If you use your head, and don’t go places where you know you shouldn’t. It’s called ‘common sense’

hitch hikeing isn’t a worry

Glad to hear you have no crazy people there

sleeping in the bush. don’t need to worry about animals, spiders, snakes, mosquitoes

Because that has anything to do with the President? But then again, perhaps there wasn’t as many spiders around before bush took office.[/sarcasm]

don’t need to worry about air travel

Good for you

don’t have any nukes (he he don’t even let them into our water)

I feel sorry for you. See, there will be nukes. They are nasty weapons, but pretending they don’t exsist will only cause you a rude awakening.

to me that seems to be freedom.

if i’m wrong please fill me in.

Sure will! Please explain, how that in a society, to be so great as you make it sound, there would have to be many restrictions. Would this not be countering freedom? Or is it just that one mans freedom is another mans prison?

the freedom you are talking about is called anarchy

and yes good point i suppose the bush has nothing to do with the president.

what is the point in killing people with nukes.

by nature authority is opression and nukes represent an authority over other people.

people don’t shoot other people at school yet because guns are harder to get here as we don’t have a clause in a constitution saying we have the right to them.
only hunting guns are sold anyway
no uzzzzzzzziiiiiiis or handguns as far as i know.

and they also don’t shoot other people because of common sense.
nothing stops them.
it just hasn’t happend yet

oh yeah i’m getting off topic.

my whole point was that the US is not “the free world” so can’t lay claim to that title.

call your self the “We think we are the free world but really there are other places that are free and not our enemys. WORLD”
and then i would be happy.

but for all i care my prime minister could be "the leader of the free world. "

claiming that a country is the free world implys that all other countrys are not free.

and a good point one mans freedom is anothers prison.
its all about the popular opinion that counts in democracy!!

im more irritated about the “we are the best country in the world”, “we are the greatest city in the world” and “oh look there is our flag, lets honour this peice of cloth”.

Some day I would like to get a definition on the first two of those. Exactly what are they so good at?

Boasting about it.

and as for freedom can you name one place on this planet that is free from any limitations at all.

I can’t think of any.

43 isn’t even the president of the USA

43 isn’t even the president of the USA

who is 43?
i think i missed somthing

and as for freedom can you name one place on this planet that is free from any limitations at all.

nope!!! the only way to dao that would be to live in the middle of nowhere all by yourself how you want.

kinda my point in the post “they claim they are free but really they are not anymore than a person almost anywhere else” just they think they are

“we are the best country in the world”, “we are the greatest city in the world” and “oh look there is our flag, lets honour this peice of cloth”.

Some day I would like to get a definition on the first two of those. Exactly what are they so good at?

defifinition according to some american encyclopedia
“WE ARE THE BEST COUNTRY IN THE WORLD.~ oh yes we are arn’t we”

"WE ARE THE GREATEST CITY IN THE WORLD.~ [insert your city here]

actualy to be honest.

when 9-11 happend i felt rather sorry for afganistan because i knew that they would be blown up rather fast and with no regard for civilians.
also i felt sorry for the 1,000,000 aprox afganistanian people that died while fighting for the united states against the soviets.

i liked al gore he would have been nice but its more that george bush is against everything i stand for so i don’t really like him. but thats politics isn’t it, you can’t make everyone happy.

As you know, we here in the USA are currently experiencing a strong resurgence of patriotism. This combined with a generalized fear of terrorism has made us a bit irrational and reactionary. Of coarse it’s presumptuous for us to say that our president is the “leader of the free world” but we are using pride as a defense here. We’re in a very defensive mood after 9/11. Of coarse this doesn’t excuse any transgressions on our part but what was bad news to the rest of the world literally “hit home” with us. You see my dad once worked in the Pentagon. And I recently talked with a man from New York who’s Grandfather narrowly escaped death in the WTC. That fourth plane that was stopped short of its target by brave passengers was headed for the White House.

Now I was never naive enough to think that these sorts of things could never happen here but I guess some people were and now we all realize the price of complacency. In our resolve never to let it happen again we’ve fortified ourselves with patriotism and statements about our relative stature should be viewed in that light.

I grew up in the USA and I love my country, My Home. But no man is a rock. No nation ether (geology not withstanding).
And My Home is just one part of Our Home.
Somtimes we forget that.

I usually don’t read the off-topic board, but I did for some reason, so I’ll respond…

alltaken - you’re a New Zealander, right? Good for you. I mean it. Really. I’ve speculated a couple of times that if for some reason the US went to hell in a handbasket or blew up or something, that I’d consider NZ or Australia as an alternative home for the Hess family. You’ve got a lot of things going for you. A relatively small, homogenous population with a really low population density and tons of pretty scenery to keep everyone calm and happy. Wait a minute, that sounds like almost all of the US about two hundred years ago! You could do that stuff here then, too. Walk around all night anywhere you pleased. Sleep in the woods.

A lot of the freedoms you’re talking about seem more a function of the particularly benificent geographic and demographic conditions under which you live - not your political system.

Also, NZ has going for it that you really don’t have anyone gunning for you. If you’re a small island-based nation that really doesn’t have too much of anything that anyone wants to realistically take by force, and you don’t really stand for anything that a whole lot of insane violent people hate, then of course you don’t have to worry about guns or nuclear weapons or invasion. I’ll definitely agree with you on that. During our Cold War with the Soviet Union (which, BTW, we won, and there’s tens of millions of people who are SIGNIFICANTLY more free in the world because of our efforts there) the threat of nuclear war was real, and it was definitely always a background anxiety. Sometimes a jet would go overhead, and the thought would cross your mind - are those the missiles this time? I don’t think it did me any lasting damage, but it would have been nice to grow up without having to think that. I’m glad, though, that because we went through that small discomfort that, once again, tens if not hundreds of millions of people, including yourself, do not have to live under that threat today.

As for Bush being the leader of the free world… I’m not saying that I necessarily agree. But the logic goes like this. The free world is the conglomeration of those nations that value democratic republics and, to a lesser extent (hello France!) a free market economy. In that respect, the US is easily the most powerful of all of those nations. Maybe not the best (though I personally think it is). In the unsupervised playground that is the world political scene, the most powerful IS the leader. Hence, the US is the leader of the free world. George W. Bush, being the elected leader of the US (though some goobers still dispute this, though due process was followed), could by some be considered the leader of the free world. I don’t know if I agree with the last step in that chain – he doesn’t speak for everyone in our country, just the US government, let alone in the rest of the free nations. But I think it’s more of a newsman’s term than anything else. I don’t think you’d find a whole lot of Americans willing to refer to Bush as the “leader of the free world.”

Also, how do you feel about the poor people of Afganistan now? What were the final civilian casualty rates? How did that compare to the death rate under the Taliban? I’m sure that all of the women who can have jobs again and go to school again and not get stoned to death for wearing the wrong clothes or being in the wrong place are very upset now. Life will not be easy for them or their children. Things might go crazy over there again and devolve into tribal violence. But now, at least, it might not. Maybe ten or twenty years from now, life can start to get better for these people. BTW, the Afgan people were not fighting FOR the US. We were giving them material assistance in their fight againt an occupying totalitarian regime. They were fighting for themselves.

I am glad that your life in NZ is good and easy. I am willing to accept the danger that comes from my country acting as a lightning rod for the people who would attack the institutions of freedom and personal liberty. We are strong. We can take it. So YOUR country hopefully doesn’t have to.

Of course, no one asked us to do this. So we don’t expect any thanks. In fact, we expect people to hate our guts. Because we’re trying to change things, and that upsets people. Even some good, intelligent people. But that’s okay with us, because we’re all about eveyone having their own opinion. Different points of view. Fifty years from now, though, I think that more people in this world will enjoy the freedoms that you and I take for granted. A whole lot of the Middle Eastern Muslim world lives under despotic rule - are kept truly destitute while their leaders live an opulent lifestyle unknown in the history of the world. They will be better off, hopefully, thanks to the efforts, sacrifices and risks of the US.

Evidently, getting you “irritated”.

Please remain calm, Green. Remain calm. 8)

Evidently, getting you “irritated”.

Please remain calm, Green. Remain calm. 8)[/quote]

Hey! I like getting irritated! And I allso like flamewars. But this thread shows surprisingly little effort towards that if the only us dude to dissagree is going to be acasto.

I think your missing the point. Whether or not we (or you) have nukes, someone else will. So the way it goes, if there is crazy people who have or want a weapon, you better have an equal or greater weapon or it’s your butt.

I think Harkyman is an arrogant Yank, isn’t he?

The title of the thread is too benign, in my opinion. “George Bush ain’t the leader of the free world.” C’mon, that isn’t going to get anybody’s juices flowing this early. It needs to be something more provocative and offensive. Like this: “George Bush couldn’t find his way out of a Swedish whorehouse, much less do anything worthwhile inside it”.

I think Harkyman is an arrogant Yank, isn’t he?

The title of the thread is too benign, in my opinion. “George Bush ain’t the leader of the free world.” C’mon, that isn’t going to get anybody’s juices flowing this early. It needs to be something more provocative and offensive. Like this: “George Bush couldn’t find his way out of a Swedish whorehouse, much less do anything worthwhile inside it”.[/quote]

We have whorehouses in sweden? hm… interesting

I think your missing the point. Whether or not we (or you) have nukes, someone else will. So the way it goes, if there is crazy people who have or want a weapon, you better have an equal or greater weapon or it’s your butt.[/quote]
YOU are the “someone else”.

I think Harkyman is an arrogant Yank, isn’t he?

The title of the thread is too benign, in my opinion. “George Bush ain’t the leader of the free world.” C’mon, that isn’t going to get anybody’s juices flowing this early. It needs to be something more provocative and offensive. Like this: “George Bush couldn’t find his way out of a Swedish whorehouse, much less do anything worthwhile inside it”.[/quote]

He isn’t an arrogant Yank, he just made some very important points. Please everyone, dont hate us because we are better than you.
:stuck_out_tongue:

:x :x PUTS ON FLAMEPROOF CLOTHES AND HIDES IN DITCH :x :x

Here we go!

I think Harkyman is an arrogant Yank, isn’t he?

The title of the thread is too benign, in my opinion. “George Bush ain’t the leader of the free world.” C’mon, that isn’t going to get anybody’s juices flowing this early. It needs to be something more provocative and offensive. Like this: “George Bush couldn’t find his way out of a Swedish whorehouse, much less do anything worthwhile inside it”.[/quote]

He isn’t an arrogant Yank, he just made some very important points. Please everyone, dont hate us because we are better than you.
[/quote]
Says who? :slight_smile:

Hmm… I don’t get it.