Grammar anyone?

This has been bothering me for a long time, but I’ve been afraid to say anything because I have a good idea of what’s going to come of it…

I am sick to death of long run-on sentences spattered with “lol, uhhh…” etc, which make no sense and yet seem to be begging for help or making a criticism. This is not instant messaging. If you’ve got something to say, take a few seconds and communicate in an intelligible manner.

I have run across several posts that are almost impossible to understand. I’m not talking about non-English speakers - just people who choose to write unintelligible nonsense.

I’m not asking for perfect grammar or flawless spelling. I’m not an English teacher. I’m just saying that if you’d like someone to help you, you may want to communicate in a way that can be understood.

Ok…here it comes…

Edit:
I found this quote on the forums…there are others like me…

“And one final thing. However, this is very important. Spelling and grammar go a long way. Please try to use them so we can better understand your project. Also, you look a whole lot better if you can prove that you can at least put forth the effort to practice correct spelling and grammar.”

Agreed.
It’s one thing for native English speakers to k now their slangs and sms/instant messages vocabulary. But it is another thing for other people.

There are some replies that I give up on reading, because they lack any punctuation and are full of “phonetic” writing that makes no sense.

There’s an intresting tendency in german too. My native is german, well something similar to that. We got dozends of dialects here, however, when i browse a german board i see bad and worse spelling and grammar. Mistakes a 8 year old would make, from obviously mature people - at least by age. No one cares anymore, and the actually spoken language is full of neoanglizisms making me feel old… or simply strange listening to it…

I know what you mean. I have asked people to restate their questions from time to time. I think this has also something to do with age as a lot of the viewers on this board tend to be 15 and under… no time for spelling I guess.

I think the problem is partially due to the fact that most people use the Post Quick Reply button and don’t bother to reread their message for spelling, grammar etc…

I think a obligatory preview would get people to reread their posts and prevent spamming the board at the same time. (Two POST requests instead of just one is something most scripts cannot manage :slight_smile: )

Yes, I agree. Sometimes i have to reread something a few times because it’s written poorly.

I agree totally. I think everybody could make a small effort to be understandable to readers of the message, especially people with English as their first language. It’s very inconsiderate of those people to use unintelligible English slang on an international board.

What also annoys me frequently are posts with no indication where sentences and paragraphs should end… I usually quit reading after three lines.

I’ll join the “grumpy old men” on this one, though It does seem like anyone disagreeing on this thread would have a hard time!

I’m all too guilty of mis typing a lot and hitting “post reply” …“mostly” I re-read once it’s up and DO edit it though.

Even for FireFox you can get a spell checker installed. I am using the us-dictionary for the forums here.

Me h8 grammarz >: (


|square–|

square–

Such a nice shape.

Correct grammar on an international forum with an average age of, uhhhh, 16.

Good Ruck with that one…

That’s why I just smite dragons. It’s a more fruitful pastime. :spin:

FYI most people don’t know the difference between forums and IM.

Have Fun!!!

I know this is about the forum but my outlook doesn’t have the English dictionary on it only french any ideas how to the English one?

I agree. Normally it’s because they spend hours trying to find a character on their keyboard…

i completely agree!
@arexma: haha, and the most annoying one of those is the use of “nen” as an abbreviation of “einen”. nothing bad in being a lazy typer, but people use “nen” all the time, even if the correct article would be “ein”. what abbreviation is that?! i mean, both, “nen” and “ein” have 3 letters, so why even use it? especially on heise and golem. that grammar-f*ckup seems to be spreading like a virus. but then again, why bother?
oh man, sucks to be a grammar-nazi… :yes:

but yeah, i agree with you that language, grammar and spelling should be cultivated and given more attention.
ha! well, as a non-native speaker with probably LOTS of mistakes that’s a rather dumb statement…:eyebrowlift2: hey, perhaps there should be forum for focused language critique?:smiley:

Yeah, I think that at least some decent grammar/spelling should be a requirement. And nothing kills my desire to help you like a lack of periods. It’s not that hard, and it’ll save everybody time since we’ll know what you mean the first time around.

Ha, would it be possible for somebody to code a script for the message-box that would block posts with ‘lolz, teh’s’ etc etc. At least for the support forums(obviously netspeak is not so much an issue in off topic).

But I definitely agree, one of the first things I notice in a post is the spelling and grammar, and I instantly draw conclusions and judge you negatively if you don’t bother to write well. If english isn’t your first language, then of course that’s fine, but when it feels like I’m reading a myspace bullitin, it just turns me off.

I agree with the ideals presented in this thread. The only unfortunate thing is that most of the “excuses” as to why its happening is pushed to the “younger” guys…or at least thats the sentiment I’ve gotten from reading.

I believe the real issue has very little to do with age. It has to do with laziness. It’s futile to ask for people to write complete sentances, or properly spell something, or use any form of grammer when, on a day to day basis, EVERYONE literally rapes their own language. If there were no issues with our spoken language, there would be no possible way (other than laziness or ignorance) to write down these errors. Take any literature from the “earlier” days in any language. For instance take the declaration of independance (not saying its literature…but its the first thing that came to mine)…I’d assume we’d all agree there are no grammatical/syntax errors. Why is this? Because (we assume) they spoke with correct english.

I put forth the idea that if there were no answer to the question “who dat be?” there would be no way to spell dat, it wouldn’t exist, we’d spell it correctly as that. I suggest, instead of trying to fight the effects of an issue (grammer within the written language), you put your energy into fighting the cause (languages being raped by those that speak them). I’ve been to 4 countries whose native language was something other than English. Do you know what all 4 had in common? Every person I met in those countries spoke english that, if spoken fluently, would be considered proper english. Yet I come back home to America to hear people butchering English out of laziness and ignorance. How hard is it to enunciate?

These are only my views and just like anyone else, despite what they’d have you believe, I’m guilty of butchering my native language in the name of laziness

I agree that using proper (or at least considered) spelling and grammar improves one’s ability to communicate, but at the same time, I find folks who get their panties all in a bunch over the matter quite hilarious.

You might find this hard to believe, but many of these sloppy writers you encounter are indeed putting their best foot forward. They’re writing in the best way they know how, and in the vast majority of cases, the message is easy enough to grasp regardless of the manner in which it’s communicated. Some readers, however, put their blinders on the instant they detect a foul, and stop trying to understand at all.

During the course of your time here on Earth, you will encounter people from all walks of life. Some will care deeply about grammar and orthography, while others will not. Some will speak and write in ways you find appropriate, and others will use dialects just utterly alien to you. They will all have one thing in common, though; they will all have something to say, no matter whether you approve of their style or not.

I enjoy a well crafted sentence as much as the next guy, but the simple fact is that this is a forum. It’s not a published journal. There’s precious little editorial oversight, and the doors are open to everyone. Average, every day people come here for help and community, and they approach you as friends. They talk to you the way they talk to friends.

All I ask is that you put as much effort into understanding as you put into being understood; don’t throw away the package just because you dislike the wrapping. If you can do that one thing, checking all of your frustration, anger and reproach at the door, you might just find yourself becoming a better communicator, a sharper writer and an all around bigger person because of it.

Then maybe we can all lol together. :slight_smile:

Some of the forums I go on ban you if you have consistently bad spelling… a perma-ban. I know if we did that here we would have half the users, but really, some people need to check up on their grammar and punctuation. My eyes have bled from the horrors I have seen.

Then the real problem is not grammar, but manners?

I have been doing lots of research on language. It seems that no matter how much you attempt to correct a person’s grammar, the person will not change it unless that person truly wants to change it. Most children who have acquired around 4-5 years of language practice make mistakes that seem to correct themselves as they get older.

I’m an adult and I still use “Aks.” Where I come from this word is actually normal. I heard it daily up until high school (I moved). Ask sounds weird and is a pain to pronounce. In order to change it I have to first practice saying it then recognize when I’m about to use it in conversation and purposely manuever myself to say “ASK.” Being human, far more likely to take the apparent easier route, combined with the word being used in the social groups I hang out with, makes the chance my actually changing the pronouciation almost none.

I just use myself as an example. Now imagine an entire culture of online language, with people typing and speaking in a manner for several years. To expect those people to use normal grammar when normal grammar is not their norm is insane, and a bit selfish.

I myself will skip entire posts when I don’t see punctation. But I now understand why the post appears the way it does.

The only way to get someone to type correctly would be to force their first few posts to be reviewed by a moderator before it shows up. And a warning that it doesn’t meet the standards acceptable for the subforum they are posting in. This way they are not left to assume that normal internet speech is acceptable.

Because for all the forums that stress correct typing/english there probably about as many more that really don’t give a care.

PS:

I mispelled there/their/they’re several times while typing this.

You know, I think you’re right on there. I think we could definitely call it manners, and therefore it should also be understood that there are times and places for different language. I talk slightly differently depending on who I’m with. In an effort to ‘fit in’ and make connections, our minds(in this case, our speech) will mimic the environment it’s presented with.

I think that a lot of kids just think of the net in general as a big IM/myspace zone, and communicate accordingly. So I suppose you’re right, it is more of an etiquette issue.

don’t worry, one day 1337 will become the default mode of speaking, people will audibly say things like “brb”, and we’ll all have to relearn the language.