Hollywood's Greatest Trick - a documentary about the exploitative VFX industry

Having actually seen the film, I have “learned” a few things:

The VFX studios seem to use mostly fixed price bids for jobs that have constantly changing requirements. That’s a recipe for disaster.

Countries like Canada are dumping billions into getting a share of that shitty market. That’s just stupid.

Even in a film which (presumably) argues for unionization, not a single person makes a credible argument on how unionization could actually work. You basically have saxophone guy lay back and say “frickin’ Sandy Bullock made 62 million, why shouldn’t you get a piece of the pie?”. Well, there’s only one Sandy Bullock and she’s in a position to walk away from any job. Everyone else seems to have a sober perspective: It’s an industry running on passion, it’s not sustainable, etc.

The best part though, is the German guy who left his beautiful homeland so he could make a measly 100.000$ working 80hr weeks and who could only afford a used Porsche 911. I’m sure he has the deepest sympathies of union workers across the world.

Agreed.

If you look at the top grossing movies in any year for the last decade, you’ll see they’re heavily VFX-dependent. And overall profits for Hollywood have grown as movies became more spectacular.

I agree that we might have better movies if all movies were Richard Linklater Before Midnight-style dramas without VFX spectacle - but since “fooling yourself” seems to be your favourite term, I think we’d be ‘fooling ourselves’ if we claimed that Hollywood would still make Titanic/Avatar/Star Wars profits if VFX would disappear. :wink:

Nobody’s asking Hollywood to become unprofitable - just to make sure that VFX studios can be sustainable. Indeed, everyone could use a bigger piece of the pie but at least screenwriters and DOPs don’t go bankrupt for Oscar-winning work. They have their labour rights sorted out by their respective unions.

It is important for whether or not a movie grosses a billion dollars. A film doesn’t make hundreds of millions or a billion because it got made, it’s because a ton of people want to see it. And I don’t see Lars von Trier’s Festen breaking Avatar’s box office soon.

You can be ideologic without being utopian. Capitalism, specifically neoliberalism is an ideology - and currently a very dominant one.

I don’t understand why it was realistic for all the other areas of the movie industry to unionise but for VFX it suddenly is unrealistic and one would be fooling themselves if they thought the VFX industry could and should unionise.

Don’t mix up causation and correlation. Of course a big budget movie now uses VFX everywhere. In the past, that was relegated to a few scenes. The VFX budget (percentage) wasn’t necessarily much different though. The growth in profits is almost certainly attributable to the growth in foreign markets like China. The domestic market hasn’t grown in twenty years.

Now, you may presume the Chinese won’t go to see US movies as much if there was less VFX, but the current growth is due to relaxed government policies. Some even argue the Chinese market is ruining Hollywood movies. The other foreign markets have always swallowed up whatever the US produces.

I agree that we might have better movies if all movies were Richard Linklater Before Midnight-style dramas without VFX spectacle - but since “fooling yourself” seems to be your favourite term, I think we’d be ‘fooling ourselves’ if we claimed that Hollywood would still make Titanic/Avatar/Star Wars profits if VFX would disappear. :wink:

I’m not so sure about that. If VFX would disappear (which is of course absurd, just an extreme example), the size of the audience would still stay the same.

Sure enough, you’d never go see ‘Transformers’ or ‘Avengers’ without all that VFX, because without the VFX these movies are nothing. You’d go see another movie instead. However, movies like Star Wars or LoTR could work with much less VFX (and they already did, compared to those other films). One particular scene in “Hollywood’s Greatest Trick” shows how the actors now get their final makeup through VFX. I think that’s terrible.

Nobody’s asking Hollywood to become unprofitable - just to make sure that VFX studios can be sustainable. Indeed, everyone could use a bigger piece of the pie but at least screenwriters and DOPs don’t go bankrupt for Oscar-winning work. They have their labour rights sorted out by their respective unions.

These things were sorted out many decades ago, in a completely different Hollywood. Interesting story, but besides the point, that work is just too different. You can’t replace a writer or an actor (or even a caterer!) with some guy sitting in Canada or India.

It is important for whether or not a movie grosses a billion dollars. A film doesn’t make hundreds of millions or a billion because it got made, it’s because a ton of people want to see it. And I don’t see Lars von Trier’s Festen breaking Avatar’s box office soon.

Again, correlation and causation. If everyone is cranking VFX up to 11, then of course all the most successful movies will also be heavy on VFX. If everyone starts dialing down again, that doesn’t mean the most successful movies will be less successful. Regarding CG VFX, the top grossing movies of all time (US) didn’t really have any (except for Titanic).

You can be ideologic without being utopian. Capitalism, specifically neoliberalism is an ideology - and currently a very dominant one.

Well, I already told you that my ideology is “utopian”. I absolutely don’t believe that the free market solves everything. I’m not telling you how things should be, but how I see them.

I don’t understand why it was realistic for all the other areas of the movie industry to unionise but for VFX it suddenly is unrealistic and one would be fooling themselves if they thought the VFX industry could and should unionise.

Again, in the film you posted, nobody makes a good argument on how it could work, even though everyone shares the sentiment. The problem with this type of work is that it is easily outsourcable, in large parts. That’s an issue many parts of the economy have. Unionizing can not solve that problem. Maybe Donald Trump is gonna do you the favor of making outsourcing less profitable…

As somebody with a keen eye for VFX you may make the mistake of believing that audiences deeply care about the difference (or even can tell the difference) between AAA work from the US and B+ work from India. Just take a look at Enthiran,which has tons of VFX, at a twenty million budget. The quality is on par with what Hollywood did fifteen years ealier, but they’re catching up.

I’ll believe that films like audiences enjoy stuff like Enthiran, which I had never heard of before, as much as Hollywood AAA blockbusters once those films make as much money as Hollywood AAA blockbusters.

Anyway - this here is leading nowhere. My stance is and remains:“The VFX industry in the west is fucked and I’d rather try to improve the conditions here, at the risk of having shit jobs outsourced to Asia, than to accept and endure those shit jobs here.”

I don’t even disagree that it’s difficult to succeed - the only thing we seem to disagree about is our attitude towards it.

“Grossing” ≠ “Profitable”.

I’m not sure what smaller studios you are referring to that people should jump ship to. At least not here in the U.S.

The reality in the U.S. is that the VFX industry is all but dead. It was killed by government subsidies in England and Canada. I have first hand knowledge of bidding on major shows and being told by the studios that no matter what our bid was, we would not get the job. It was going to London. The studio had no idea WHERE in London it was going. Merely that it would be somewhere there because of the tax advantages they would be raking in.

Don’t get me wrong, the London VFX houses are some of the best in the world. But they would have to be. They get a constant stream of work which allows them to hire huge teams of talented people, all thanks to the influx of massive amounts of taxpayer money.

In the U.S. we are left with smaller and smaller jobs which means we run on tighter budgets, shorter schedules, and lower pay. We have smaller R&D departments because of budget cuts. (In Canada the B.C. government will pay up to 60% of an R&D person’s salary. Potentially more if they affiliate with a local University). Our equipment is more out of date.

The MPAA did this in collusion with various governments around the world. There is no more jumping ship for the vast majority of us. At this point I would be happy to be exploited by ANY company anywhere near my home. Instead I’ll just have to watch the film industry rake in record profits thanks to the poor working class people of Canada and England who are forced to subsidize their industry.

Don’t validate bullshit Hollywood accounting with claims like that.

He’s not validating the Hollywood practice of fucking people over with residuals by pointing out that it exists.

Also, gross not being equal to (or implying) profit is a plain fact. Ghostbusters was one of the top-grossing movies of 2016, and it still lost tons of money (even without Hollywood accounting!).

Ouch. Thanks for the warning, I guess.