how to use AO but not as the main texture

hi all,
i know the topic might sound weird and senseless but ill try to explain what im trying to do,here s the following:
i created a high poly landscape mesh and sculpt it then i duplicated it,afterwards in one of the copys i applied the decimate modifier in order to make it as low poly as possible and then i baked an Ambient occulsion from the high poly over the low poly,but before baking i created a new UV image so the AO could be saved and loaded as a texture,and the reason why i m doing this not sure if it sounds obvious but is to make a low poly landscape look like a high poly,just like normal maping faking a high poly mesh,but now i want to apply a grass texture and a sand texture and with an alpha image paint the stencil map however i dont know how to perform such a thing,the AO texture seems to be the main one and i wanted it to be as a secondary image just to give a volume to the mesh…not sure if the text is clear enough but if this is not clear enough i can try to rephrase it…
thanks in advance for any help,
Romy

it seems that i did something wrong coz i cant even scale the image in the x,y axis to make it tile…help needed

texturing in the 2.58 version becomes completely diferent,i need help!

Please don’t make it difficult for people to help you. Always attach your blend file to your post (make sure you pack your textures) or we’re working blind here.

Hi Richard,
sorry for rthe lack of info ,i just didnt upload the file coz in my mind i think ppl get pissed when i need help in the file specificly,but for me is much better and easier for u guys to detect the problem so here it is the file :
http://www.pasteall.org/blend/7607
and plz i need it to work for ge not only for render!
thanks a lot,
Romy

PS: when fixed i need to know what was changed or the procedures so next time i know what to do thnx

Sorry, but I got to rip your work apart.
Looking at your file it seems you don´t really know what you´re doing.

  1. You don´t have GLSL activated but multitexture, you won´t see all textures properly with that.
  2. Your UV unwrap is a catastrophe and a waste of of space. Why do you unwrap a rectangular shape 45° turned instead of fitting it to the texture?
  3. You have to set the AO texture to multiply, not to mix. AO is by default multiplied in the render equation, sometimes added.
  4. your stencil texture is all black. It will show nothing below it because white is transparent, black is opaque.
  5. your scene settings are ridiculous, near clip .1 far clip 10000 and the landscape is still clipping, all you get is z-buffer problems when rendering, no matter if it is in BGE or BI. You don´t even have blender set to any unit system. Scale it down.
  6. turn the mesh to smooth when baking textures
  7. you got holes in your mesh causing black artifacts.
  8. the order of your textures is wrong. You need: base diffuse (ground), AO multiply, shadowmap, stencil, sand.
  9. compress your file before uploading. I added a texture and mine´s now 13mb not 24.
  10. turn down material specularity for landscapes.

I fixed that:
http://www.pasteall.org/blend/7610

I used a sunlight with rayshadows to bake the shadowmap. Afterwards I turned it to a hemi light, it casts no shadows but lights the scene nice, in the same angle the scene is lit, so specularity of other stuff will match lateron.
I used raytraced AO instead of 0pass approximated.
I setup the textures as told in 8)
Enter edit mode, make the stencil map active in the uv editor, enter texture paint in 3d viewport and paint your stencilmap, the sand will appear where you paint white(ish)

It looks exactly the way it looks in the viewport in the BGE.

Baking shadows and AO into the scene and using a hemi light gives a nice control over the “lightness” in shadows, so you can fake a look that mimes GI and you can color the hemilight… I choose a orange-yellowish, for an afternoon in the desert.

hope that helps.

Hi Arexma,
thanks a lot for all ur inputs,and i didnt realize it was set to multitexture Arghhh…the textures order i just made that for the forum coz i only had the ao applied before,and yeah i thought the correct order would be the difuse first and the stencil i didnt paint the white area coz i set it just as a ilustration for ur guys,and i tought the the Ao could be multiply instead of mix but i wasnt sure,bout the z-bufffer and distance i had no idea how to fix it lol and no idea what i was doing ur right but with all those inputs u made i learned lot from it and i really appreciate that,i know im still noob hehe its always good to learn from who really knows what is doing…the compression id say yeah it makes sense lol sorry for that…the spec i would be doing it later i know that but i know ur intension is to teach me properly and i apreciate u pointing those out!
closing arguments :
“wow what a class and how kind u are to formulate this lesson ,really thax a bunch cfor everything,no words express my appreciation!”
All the best,
Romy

Btw i saved all of ur explanations in a text file!

No problem. I think it´s only decent and fair to tell you how to do it right or where to improve after tearing your work to pieces :slight_smile:

The z-buffer problem is fixed by setting the near and far values of the clipping. You got a view frustum (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viewing_frustum) One for your Blender viewport, it is set in the properties sidepanel (toggle with <n>) and each camera has one, even the one for the BGE. So what is closer than the near plane is clipped and what is behind the far plane is clipped as well.

I will not explain it completely accurate (I am not 100% certain how it works in Blender anyways) and only use made up numbers, but in theory you will know what happens.
The first good idea is to set Blender to use meter or yards, whatever you prefer, most game-engines though work with metric units because they don´t have to calculate floating point numbers but only integers and it´s much faster.
You can also use Blender Units, but you should keep track of your proportions and size.

So now lets say your landscape is supposed to be 1000x1000 meters
For some odd reason you think you have to work in centimeters and make your landscape in blender 10000x10000 that´s huuge.
you also want to see stuff that is very close to you, so you set your frustrum to near 1mm, that´d be 0.1 and to far 10000 that´d be the 1km.
that´s an aweful long span of numbers.
Now we assume the variable holding the z-depth can only have 6 digits.
10000 has already 5, so you can have 10000.0
However having only 1 digit after the decimal point, means to the bottom that 0.1 can have no more digits behind.
If there are 2 planes in your scene now, that are 0.05 apart, it can´t be calculated which one is in front. 0.05 would be either 0 or 0.1 depends on how it is rounded/truncated, and both planes have the same z-depth and you get those flickering black geometry.

If you scale down your scene to work with meters, you´d have 1000 by 1000 and your near 0.1 and far 1000.
You still can use 6 digits, now you range from 0.10 to 1000.00 - Yay. If 2 things are apart now 0.01 the z.depth can still be determined properly.

It´s only half the truth, there is much more to it, but simplified speaking that´s the reason.
Rule of thumb, the closer the near clipping comes towards 0, the less precision you have. In OpenGL it always hase to be a positive number btw. negative and zero are not allowed.

If you want to know more you can read this:
http://www.opengl.org/resources/faq/technical/depthbuffer.htm

Wow right on,i had no idea about those things and im still a bit confused since the text is a little too big lol but very enlightening,ill check that later but now i ran into a new problem lol,one of them i solved which was scale down my characters and objects without keeping the old loc/scale/rot by just holding shift and then that made the trick however now i got another problem which i cant seem to find a way around it,when i append lets say my character s file,i try to move him around and place in another area after i press “P” to play , it gets back to the old position when it was appended,how do i get rid of that? and when i just link library i can place the object in different position…can u hook me up again dude?
thanks in advance,
Romy