Lair of the brass Dragon (nevermind, currently revamping the pic. anyway)

(Ace Dragon) #1

http://img217.imageshack.us/my.php?image=0313qn3.jpg
http://gallery.mudpuddle.co.nz/albums/kansas15/0313_G.thumb.jpg
First time in months I modeled part of a Dragon, though unlike the previous Dragons, I took more care in modeling it in a good way, and the pose with the arm is different from some of the previous ones.

Also, you can’t really comment on textures for colors here, because it doesn’t use any, it’s a whole world of brass. Dragon hand is sculpted, but because I could use edge creases with multires I used displacement modifiers set to vertex groups for the head. (allows more control and more tolerance if it doesn’t work in some ways). Procedural voronoi was used for the scales on the head in two sizes.

I personally think it turned out pretty good, any problems were easily fixed in postpro.

EDIT: Turns out it did need improving, I’ve completely redone the lighting and made changes and will be up in another thread with a completely different image. I’m going to put it up together with another image because I don’t want to waste another thread just on an improved version.

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(Marsan) #2

Imageshack - bad
use the same dragon over and over again - bad

It kinda gives me nothing. The picture would give me more pleasure without the dragon.

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(andrewprice) #3

You really love that dragon don’t you? It looks so awkward though. It’s not posed properly. A dragon should be scary, yours looks, well, funny actually.

As for the composition its not so bad. It could do with some more colour, or glow, but all in all not too bad. I like the detailed patterns in the pillars although a little repetative.
It is too crowded however. You would benefit from doing some drawings before launching into it. Also I just noticed the ground looks like the pattern you see from a family size chocolate bar.

I give it a 2.5/5 you had the right idea, but the lack of thought towards layout and the fact that you once again included the dragon (have you noticed he doesn’t have any eyes?) makes this a not so good render. But keep trying! You’re on the right track.

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(Ace Dragon) #4

Hmmm, I liked it, yet the general opinion of the forum differs, the replies and the rating are not unusual for me unfortunately. Trust me, I’ve gotton more 1 star ratings then anyone else on the forum.

And I’ve modeled this Dragon from scratch.

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(Smoking_mirror) #5

I like it!

The dragon looks cool, just because he’s not naturalistic doesn’t mean that he doesn’t have merit.

If you plan on using the dragon, use him as a themed motif, perhaps as a logo, or carved relief above a doorway. The scene looks good, but it is too complex without recognizable detail.

Think about what you want it for, is it going to be a single scene maybe as a desktop background? Then you need more recognizable detail, such as figures or pseudo mechanical bits and pieces worked in to the background, rather than lots of extruded shapes that don’t really do anything.

If you are serious about improving your 3d design skills I’d recommend setting yourself a series of projects to master the basic areas of 3d design.

1. Modeling. Make the dragon, try to keep it under 2000 triangles. Plan to use it in later projects so think about how it will UV texture and maybe how it will rig.

2. Texturing. texture the dragon. Yes UV mapping is difficult, but at least with bender you have picked one of the easiest UV mapping programs you’ll find. Watch some video tutorials. Try mapping some basic shapes first such as cubes, or stick figures. When you have a basic working understanding of UV texturing you’ll find your projects improve 100% or more.

3. 3d scenes. Make an environment for the dragon. Use what you’ve learned from the dragon model. keep it simple. Again no more than 2000 triangles. Try to achieve as much detail as you can through texturing.

4. Animation. Rig the dragon, again it’s a very difficult procedure, I’ve not got the hang of soft body rigging in blender myself yet, but I’ve had experience of it in other programs and all I can say is practice and practice some more. Start small with stick figures and then use the knowledge you acquire from those tests to rig the dragon. Put him in your scene and practice moving him around.

5. Special effects. When you’ve got the basics you can move on to the eye candy, explosions, hair, water simulations, cloth and rag doll physics are all things that Blender can offer you once you have improved your skills.

I’ve spent years trying to teach myself 3d design and animation, and this is the best way by far, set yourself learning projects and assignments. Test our skills and then put the finished project on display for public approval. I promise you you’ll get good feedback.

I can see you’ve got talent, it just needs further development and training. Good luck and happy blending! :slight_smile:

(I’m new to blender myself, I’ve only been using it a few months).

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(Smoking_mirror) #6

p.s. I gave it 3 stars which seems to have bough it up to a two. Don’t lose heart.

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(Ace Dragon) #7

I may end up modeling the whole thing for later scenes, it’s just the rigging, I know of the easy way to do it (bone envelopes), but then I hear of the new bone heat weighting and dual quaternion skinning

If I could get a build with Wizard’s tiles, Broken’s stuff, Jahka’s particles, and the things I mentioned above that would be great…

p.s. I gave it 3 stars which seems to have bough it up to a two. Don’t lose heart.

I’m aware of that, In my opinion, 3 stars should be for normal quality, 4 should be for higher quality, and a solid 5 should be for the absolute best. In my opinion, 1 star ratings should be saved for the absolute worst art in this forum.

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(dudecon) #8

Hey Cyborgdragon. Ditto on what Smoking_mirror is saying. I see a lot of myself a few years ago in your posts and pictures. It’s tough to make good looking finished pieces, but you have to stick it out through all the hard details.
One more thing though. When working on a composition, start with a 2d thumbnail, no more than 100 pix square. Draw it in the Gimp or windows paint or something. You could even draw it pencil and crayons, but don’t make it 3d. Use the thumbnail to get the composition, colors, and contrast. This is really important, if it doesn’t look good as a postage stamp, it will never look good as a full image. Play around with it until you are really happy with how the thumbnail looks. I know it sound a bit backword, but if you are making a finished image it will end up being 2d, and 2d is where you should start the design. Once you have the thumbnail, refer to it often while making the scene, and you will be amazed at how much better things will start looking.

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(free_ality) #9

Take out that nasty dragon, and youve got a pretty nice little envoronment(not finished image though). I dont see why you keep it, it does look rather silly.
And btw, just because you modeled it from scratch doesnt make its dorkiness any more acceptable. Maybe start a WIP for modeling a dragon or something,t hen you can get some good critiques, and a better result.

Keep trying…

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(Ace Dragon) #10

I don’t get why it’s only my Dragons that almost no one likes, in fact I also don’t get why I’m the only common active artist period who gets 1 star ratings. I’ve been using Blender for 3 years and I’m still famous in the opinion of some for low ratings and bad art.

All I wanted to do was please people here, not draw fire for it being bad. I wanted to make the people here go ‘hey, that’s good’. Unfortunately this is only the 50th piece I posted where more people then anticipated didn’t like it much.

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(BigBlend) #11

From the horses mouth.

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(Ace Dragon) #12

You don’t get my opinion on what one star work is, I mean as in work with artifacts, normal errors, bowtie faces, or literal scribbles like a 2 year old.

This doesn’t have any of that.

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(superkoop) #13

I’ve been using Blender for 3 years

That is why you get low ratings. You have used blender for a few years now, and yet you aren’t listening to people so you can get better.

I don’t get why it’s only my Dragons that almost no one likes

If someone else posted a dragon like that, people wouldn’t like it.

I used to feel sorry for you, now your just getting annoying.

My advice to you, start a thread in the WIP, listen to the criticisms, and then do what people tell you to do. Otherwise just grow up and change.

BTW, your not getting rated on your pics, your getting rated because you keep posting without following peoples advice.

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(Enjay) #14

you know what cyborg dragon? take this bit of advice.

Art is never meant to please everyone. and you shouldnt try and please anyone. art is like music, not everyone likes the same kind of music. some like rock, some like rap, some you can get to listen to rock, some will never be caught dead listening to rock. whats important is that you alow your self to grow in what you like, with out leting the storm of everyone around you to damage your growth. but dont be afraid of these storms either. people are like storms, some will help you grow, others will stand in your way. just keep running down the road you think is right, and dont stop or change course for no one because thats how you get lost. instead run with all your strength as fast as your legs can carry you down the road you choose, and eventually you will notice people will start to run beside you. and with the help of those around you, no storm can ever break you.

in summary: listen to advice, but dont let yourself be corrupted.

(gee… where did that come from… see what happens when i think? this is why i choose not to)

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(Ace Dragon) #15

I don’t post in WIP because I want to prove I don’t need any help to make my work any good.

If someone else posted a dragon like that, people wouldn’t like it

I took care in modeling it making sure it was modeled better then any previous Dragons I did. And it’s supposed to be made of brass, including the eyes. I get the idea people here prefer generic or photorealistic versions of the different major art genre’s over stuff that isn’t. All the stuff on this page (as of current) rated 5 stars is either a human character (or one with a mech), a car, a drum set, and a photorealistic render.

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(superkoop) #16

I don’t post in WIP because I want to prove I don’t need any help to make my work any good.

And THAT, is the problem. EVERYONE needs help. Your not an exception, so learn some humility buddy. If you REALLY wanted to get good, you would start WIP threads and listen to what people tell you, and change accordingly.
It’s good to have your own style, but a good artist recognizes when he needs help, and accepts it. GRATEFULLY!

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(Ace Dragon) #17

Look I’m trying my best not to explode in front of the critics.

I just don’t want to look like I need help making my art. I desire to prove to people I can do it all myself.

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(Inmare) #18

You need help.

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(free_ality) #19

Id love you to prove that, CD, but for years you’ve failed to do so.

The truth is, we hate your dragons because they arent very good. In fact, ‘they’ seems to be about 2 dragons. That you use over and over. And the use of them never gets better.

Sorry man, you just hevent found your artistic rythym yet…

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(dudecon) #20

Cyborg Dragon, please believe me when I say I know what you mean. I’ve been there many times myself, thinking “Man, I did pretty well, I’ll bet everyone will be impressed” and being proven wrong. For years I turned out junk (I still make a lot of junk) and it never got better. I got faster at making junk, but it was still junk. You know what changed that though? Learning to say “I need your help”. I was finally able to accept criticism and change my methods and improve.

All I wanted to do was please people here, not draw fire for it being bad

Well, you know what, I think you are lying to yourself. I did for years! The truth is, I wanted to be lazy, to exert minimum effort and make something everyone liked. I wanted quality to be easy, and I tried every way to make something good without working for it. You know what? Nothing beats hard work like hard work, and nothing beats being humble like being humble, and nothing beats listening to advice like listening to advice.

Admitting that I’m a lousy artist was really hard, but it was a huge step toward being able to make something I’m proud of, and that other people enjoy.

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