Large basic maritime Routes work in progress.


(barrymaritime) #1

Works in progress I think fits the description of the forum.
Closed my domain website for now so no further downloads available as before.
Blender Game Engine I use for making large maritime routes based on satellite srtm2 data.
Interests are the past ages and bygone times up to about 1815 so the age of sail and possibly early paddle steamers.

Restarted working around the UK coastline again starting from the Solway Firth so the age of sail.
Routes sizes are 20 km up to 43 km currently which is the size of the full Isle of Man just made.

At present working within the parameters of the current game engine.
If the game engine becomes unworkable I will simply just use it up to the last suitable working version relevant for maritime and river basic routes of around 30km size length. Limited dissolve reduces the vertex count over much of the sea and estuaries…

If REQUESTED ONLY, I can give further details of method use for making the terrain and opening up rivers, etc . Animations are on hold until I know what will continue to work with forthcoming Game Engine. Previously I was unable to make routes larger than 10km either side of the centre. as the vertices used to ‘fly back’ when moved. This appears to have been fixed wihch enabled me to make the larger routes.

I have no interest in small games or artwork etc, only real life routes based on the past ages. Same applies to criticism which I ignore and not relevant and not wanted, as there are reasons to keep to basics and enable the frame rate vert, sync at 60. Example sea and estuaries are a single semi- transparent water sheet same size as route. This can be animated to rise and fall a meter or so to simulate wave swell or a section of tidal rise can be made. River mersey has a 9 meter tidal rise in real life. Rivers created by lowering terrain so water sheet shows through. Ships will be solid schooners and sailing barges/flats etc, solid sails. So NOT a sailing simulator as such but more a ‘model’ saling ship coastal routes with basic animations. Same as drivable and floating ships can be made also numerous scenarios possible collecting crew etc.

Finally I am ONLY interested in relevant workable Game Engine functions within the parameters required to make the maritime routes!.

Functions that work in Blender might not work in larger maritime routes so no tutorials required unless previoudly tested by others on route sizes about 20 up to about 30 kilometers in length or a little over.

Happy Sailing

Barry


Some posts are missing?
(billyzill) #2

Hi Barry!

Great to see you continuing work on this project. I am very excited to hear about any and all progress that you make.

Amen.


(barrymaritime) #3

I don’t think basic maritime routes can ever be ‘completed’, as there will always be things that can be added or alterations made or textures altered etc.

Routes at 30 km would need about 400 making to follow around all of the UK coastline.

What I woulld be interesting is for others to make their own maritime basic routes of any part/era of the world as to make the basic terrain mesh is very simple and any parts of the world can be made based on real life dtata (srtm2)…It is all dependant though on the srtm2 script continuing to work and the terrain mesh only takes a few minutes to make. Then rivers and estuaries can be made and terrain textured in alternative ways. Basic water sheet added and roaming camera. Docks harbours, ports, ships, barges can be made, trees, vegetation, and so on. Working locks and canals can be made. Scenarios easily made using visible/invisible function, etc, and so on. Also copy and paste of objects seems to work OK, including roaming camera, water sheet, etc.

All these things I have made previously but ended up deleting the lot.

Thanks for your post and can help/advise with the method to get started should others be interested.
Perhaps then they could perhaps experiment on their own maritime routes within the parameters as detailed and post details?.

Maybe start at 20 km size which would allow ships to move between 2 ports/harbours, etc.
Further details can be added if requested. Basic (solid) Ships can easily be made by extruding down from the deck outline or sideways to make the hull. Then add superstructure or mast and sails, etc.

Thanks

Barry


(barrymaritime) #4

I don’t think basic maritime routes can ever be ‘completed’, as there will always be things that can be added or alterations made or textures altered etc.

Routes at 30 km would need about 400making to follow around all of the UK coastline.

What I woulld be interesting is for others to make their own maritime basic routes of any part/era of the world as to make the basic terrain mesh is very simple and any parts of the world can be made…It is all dependant though on the srtm2 script continuing to work and the terrain mesh only takes a few minutes to make. Then rivers and estuaries can be made and terrain textured in alternative ways. Basic water sheet added and roaming camera. Docks harbours, ports, ships, barges can be made, trees, vegetation, and so on. Working locks and cansls ana be made. Scenarios easily made using visible/invisible function, etc, and so on. Also copy and paste of objects seems to work OK, including roaming camera, water sheet, etc.
All these things I have made previously but ended up deleting the lot.

Thanks for your post and can help/advise with the method to get started.
Perhaps then they could perhaps experiment on their own maritime routes within the parameters as detailed and post details?.
Maybe start at 20 km size which would allow ships to move between 2 ports/harbours, etc.

To get started see link in the last paragraph on the following page…srtm2 version 2
https://www2.jpl.nasa.gov/srtm/

Barry


(BluePrintRandom) #5

hey berry,

I use about 200 tiles in manic mack, that are 16x16 faces.
as the player moves it checks placed tiles to see if 1 is too far away, if it is it’s marked free.

1 time per frame it places a world tile in a open space of one is free.

doing something similar for your own project could yield accurate and consistent results.

and the map could be as big as the whole planet I believe.

I store data about each chunk in a grid using

(gridPos) : (vertexDictionary)

where the vertex dictionary lookes like

(V_index) : (Normal,Height,VertexColor)

which are stored as tuples (RGBA) etc for conserving memory space.


(barrymaritime) #6

Hi… I am getting on in years so more a case of keeping things as simple as possible based on the methods I know how to use.

I am all for real life simulations as mentioned and interesting to see your video. I would be interested to hear of other possible methods that have been tested for maritime routes at about 20 to 30 km size or more, using Blender Game Engine. They Seem to work OK on 6 year Nivdia graphics card. Thanks B.


(wkk.py) #7

What other solutions ?

If you want something 30km long, with a decent amount of details, then you need to start managing your own tile (or object/LOD) system, so that not everything is constantly loaded into memory. Its simply a case of optimisation.

In that way, the system showcased by BPR is the best approach to use.

edit: (and the “I made something that run on a teapot” argument isn’t valid as far as we have no blend/video to prove the point)


(barrymaritime) #8

As it just a hobby I will probably just leave ships static for now until I see what changes BGE brings. So far previous complex docks of 1815 era at 20 km Liverpool Mersey route and working locks at the Ellesmere Port barge complex upriver, AI ships, all worked well with three drivable ships including schooner. Also included the beginning of canals Leeds and Shropshire Union.

4000 miles say of navigable coastline needs many 100s of routes… and a lot of time.
30 kilometer is not very large as most of the seabed can be removed using limited dissolve etc so 30 km length but maybe15 km width of terrain, depends on shape of terrain. Sea is a single sheet and so on.

If others make similar, optimised, large maritime routes then of course I will be interested to read about them, but for myself there are no problems whatsoever for the type of routes I make. It is about the past ages and bygone times and the maritime routes don’t need much complexity. The era is up to about 1815 I can only make a very small amount of content based on the available past details, etc.

Barry


(barrymaritime) #9

As mentioned I seem to be the only one on these forums who makes maritime routes! Of course I would be pleased to help or explain the methods I am using ‘should’ anybody be interested in making BASIC maritime routes but ‘by request’.

I must stress I am NOT making a ship simulator as such as Blender I don’t think is capable of that, but it is quite capable of making maritime basic routes up to 30 km and even up to 43 km for the full Isle of Man (vert sync still 60) …solid ships, flat water plane, only single roaming camera.

Finally I will be pleased to help or explain any of the functions…also floating, drivable ships and boats. tidal rise, scenarios pushing boats, putting crew ashore, collect cargoes, etc, etc. . Making new content will be a long way off for me with this second go, following around the UK starting from the Solway Firth, as I will have to take some more photos of Liverpool old docks and waiting for the trees to get their new spring foliage. I only use my own photos for textures.

Optimisation. LOD, etc I have decided not required, too time consuming, and not necessary for what I make and methods I use… but might by necessary for others who perhaps have a low end computer or laptop. Current vert sync never drops below default 60.

Further details by request.
Also say were you were up to in making the route, to enable me to explain.
Possibly 20km might be best size to enable deep water channels and sandbanks to be made and perhaps include a partial tidal rise to fill the rivers, without the need to dissolve seabed vertices.

First steps would be making terrain…
then making seabed, create rivers, osm temp texture over to create rivers by lowering terrain and following course of rivers, sea single sheet. Then perhaps photo texture river banks, add and make content, etc. My era up to about 1815 as reduces complexity.

If others make a full size, real life (srtm2) route, about 20km minimum, basic maritime route then I would be interested in further details from them.
Also I do not make further screenshots, or make routes that were previously online available. They were originally read from my domain site which I have now closed. Obviously if interested you will request further details and I will try and help or explain to RELEVANT enquiries. There is nothing for others to ‘critique’ and absolutely nothing for me to prove so.

Happy Sailing…when you make YOUR routes.

Barry

P.S.
‘If others make a full size, real life (srtm2) route, about 20km minimum, basic maritime route then I would be interested in further details from them.’
This might read wrong as it’s in addition to any help or discussion if making your own maritime routes.


(barrymaritime) #10

Should there be any reponse with people making their own srtm2 maritime route I would be very surprised…but you never know and I might get a nice surprise.
B


(barrymaritime) #11

As what I make uses the simplest methods possible, as outlined, I am considering using UPBGE…
have tried it but it would need to load routes say made in BGE with UPBGE and vica versa as the routes I make are ongoing and permanent over the years. Also an installer would be useful for upbge.

I don’t want to make routes that won’t load in the future as not small games but real life.
Exmple of simplest method is collision box around ships, but in edit mode offset so base of collision box at ships waterline. Also need to use rigid body so the ships/sailing flats bump gently against quaysides, and not bounce off or fly into air with dynamic setting. Ships can be made then for working locks using logic editor. Sea sheet has collision box at 20 km size. and will make that size terrain/sea sheet for all the routes, terrain set at 0.1 collision… no collision box. Only takes a few minutes as copy and paste used for roaming camera, and sea sheet and for ships. Script for terrain srtm2.

Just some general notes and just request if any relevant info required. For the present time will keep animations AI etc, until later to see what happens with BGE. Previously made Solway to Thames bt some routes up to 45km…this time decided on 20km max. approx. so long way to go and remade six so far with the full Isle of Man the exception at at 43km.
No tutorials wanted unless tested previously with 20 km size similar routes as kis principle used…keep it simple for anything I make.
Barry


(barrymaritime) #12

Building these types of routes can be fascinating as depends on the era set in. I am trying to keep to the age of sail up to about 1815 and that is were Google maps can be a good help. Route 7 Up to Millom and Haverigg and the current online map shows a semicircular barrage? So opened it up both ends as srtm2 data does not show the finer details and it easy easy to go a ‘drive’ around each bit of coastline or a map visit a you make each area. Especially the estuaries and small harbours. Some have become silted up though and just the remains of the old harbours show through the mud. B


(barrymaritime) #13

It would be useful if I could clamp the maximum height of the roaming camera to say 30 meters or about the limit distance HEIGHT camera view visible from coastal ships looking from 30 meters height. At present I do not know how… but needs to be simple. Using logic bricks for roaming camera movement…up/down/forward/back/left/right. Should anybody start to make similar routes you could easilly used limited dissolve on parts of the distant mountainous view but still retain the main heights of mountain outside the visible local area area.

A lot can be done using the kis principle and at the same times avoids unecessary complexity and saves time. B


(wkk.py) #14

Location Constraint Actuator - Limit Z axis.


(barrymaritime) #15

Thanks… I added two seperate constraints ‘home’ key was for up so set it at 25
Also added sepreate link for down which uses the ‘end’ key so that would save disappearing under the ‘water’.
It will probably change anyway in the 2.8 series updates.

B


(Daedalus_MDW) #16

i wouldnt worry about 2.8. theres a good chance we wont have a working engine at the first releases. and i for one, plan on sticking with 2.74 until they take it off the archives. just enjoy what you do and dont worry about staying “in the times”.

for large scale objects with big faces, physics glitch alot as you probably know. i use a raycast pointed down to find the surface and set the objects world Z position offset from the hit point.

then you can even detect if the surface belongs to a water object, and if not, have the ship run a ground. water objects could also have currents that could be detected if you wanted.

im away from my computer, but when im back, ill create a simple demo. ill focus on simplicity and ease of use.


(barrymaritime) #17

Thank for interesting reply. When I had my site I used to make the routes for download but with so little interest decided to close my site. Been about 10-12 years using Blender and I am at the other end of the age scale, so rather than get bogged down for months, I am keeping to the kis idea. I can always add bits and pieces to the differt routes based on bygone times up to about 1815…

I wondered about how to make the ships run aground and keep to deep water channels. It is easy to make the single sheet tidal as as you can choose a section of tide to start from. It uses the 12th principal. first hour rise of one twelth, 2nd hour two twelths, 3rd hour 3 twelths, 4th 3 twelths, 5th 2 twelths and 6 hour high tide, slack water at 1 twelth rise. As it rises the rivers gradually fill up.

Perhaps to make ships run aground using that method might be too difficult and also the drivable floating factor. I use an offset collision box around boat and around water water, and boat set to rigid body, in order to stop it flying into air and make it bump gently against qauys… so might be too difficult trying to fathom out things on my own. No end of scenrios can be made. At present to stop drivable ship running aground used an invisible wall to keep it ship in river or deep water channel and stop it climbing out. Essential to use rigid body fro ships as it became airborne using dynamic setting, or might richochet off quayside.

Interested though in what you suggest. If not feasible for tides could just keep water level static fixed at zero and sea depth set to about minus 9 meters on terrain mesh using linked flat planes to lower it from zero. At least the roaming camera now works better. So can copy and paste the new version into the other 10 basic routes now made up to the river Ribble.

Thanks

Barry
.


(Daedalus_MDW) #18

heres a little something i whipped up. i hope it has some useful stuff. the boat only needs a “ground” game property set to integer 0.

boat.blend (577 KB)

it doesnt have some features like running a ground, but im working on it. :slight_smile:


(barrymaritime) #19

Sounds interesting and perhaps/maybe/hopefully it might tempt somebody to join the large swelling ranks of the merry band of sailors making real life maritime routes sailing on the stormy/flat seas of Blender…free virtual rum all round…a band of one… me. Thanks. Barry


(barrymaritime) #20

Should you wish to make your own maritime routes using srtm2 and the Blender script the method I am currently using is detailed.

Although I use 3DEM, which enables me to make a height texture map, etc it is not necessary to use it but quite interesting to explore the 3D layouts of the various terrains…It is no longer supported but can be downloaded from a few sites. It is useful to make height basic textures for terrain in any range of colours.

Method I am currently using.

OpenStreetMap. Find the area of map required.
Perhaps as it’s a trial test use just UK maps then if you get stuck I can find the srtm2 section and explain further.
There are a few types, but you can chose any… standard, transport, cycle, humanitarian.
Click Export, then click manually select, and an adjustable square or oblong appears with the co-ordinates.
Perhaps initially adjust a small area for a test, maybe square 5000m but up to you

I do not download the section but I use ‘printscreen’ on computer to copy page and the co-ordinates.
You need the latitude and longitude co-odinates to enter into the srtm2 script.
Also you can crop and save the map part as a texture. I work over it to open up and trace along the rivers, etc.

For this description all we want is to make the terrain mesh for a test run… so Blender/File/Import/SRTM.
The script needs the downloaded srtm2 section to read so place them in a folder .hgt after extracting them from srtm2 zip file.

Click manually set extent box and enter co- ordinates of the latitude and longitude in the box that appears.
Then top right click import SRTM button. It is essential you browse first to open the folder where the hgt files are, otherwise the script can’t read them.

The terrain might not be visble at first so alter the default clip setting ‘end’ to approx size of route(say 10000, 20000 or whatever ). Centre the terrain mesh also make sure base on zero line. To create sea and rivers then is easy using select linked flat planes to create seabed. Single sheet for water covers whole map set to zero
Rest depend on what you wish to make/add/texture

Should you get this far I can always expand the details for any relevant queries.
I don’t think there is any more I can add as regards what I am making… as just depends on ones interests and era you chose. So at present the age of sail up to 1815 approx. but might change to small coastal about 1900 to 1950.
With this type of simulation there is NOTHING to critique and certainly NOTHING to prove. The only thing to prove is are you satisfied with the result of your route as you can always add, update and delete whatever you want from a simulation and they can never be completed for this reason. Copy and paste works fine for me for ships, roaming camera,trees and content.

Make one item and the same can be copied and pasted into any number of different routes.

Barry

https://www2.jpl.nasa.gov/srtm/