Microsoft Windows discussion

(mib2berlin) #1

Hi, it seams Microsoft does not really care as Windows 10 is “Freeware” and you still can update from 7 to 10 with Windows 7 key.
A few years ago you have to validate per telephone if you change harddisk or so.

Cheers, mib

2.8 Beta released(29/11/2018)!
2.8 Beta released(29/11/2018)!
(XYZero) #2

If I was you, I would go to that MS link and see if you get a link to download win7 TODAY!
Before things change.
Download right away, dont wait. The link is only valid for 48 hours!
If it isnt allowed…well no harm…no foul.

(xol) #3

I thought the 7-to-10 free upgrade was long over, they provide it again ?

What do you mean only 48 hours ?

(Ace Dragon) #4

The free offer has been over for a while.

If i were you, I would avoid Win10 Home in favor of Pro. Otherwise you will get the big updates quickly and join the legions of people who feel like they paid to be a beta tester. At least with Pro you can delay the big updates for up to a year.

(xol) #5

Admittingly I have no interest for 10 just yet, when support (updates) ends for 7, then will be a different story of course.

(Renzatic) #6

I’m of a split opinion on Windows 10. On one hand, MS finally got around to providing all the nifty UI features that have long since been available on Mac and Linux. Virtual desktops, an expose like window manager, scroll on mouse hover. This are things I’ve wanted for years, and they’re now standard on 10. On this front, I couldn’t be happier.

But damn if those forced updates aren’t annoying sometimes. I can understand the logic behind their decision to do this. People perpetually lagging behind on numerous security patches have always been one of the biggest vectors of attack in the Windows world. Though you’d think that, what with their being a multibillion dollar company with a huge amount of talent at their disposal, that they could’ve found a way to broach the issue with a bit more tact and savoir faire.

The way they just kinda suddenly pop it on you unawares, even when you’ve set a specific time for it to do updates, just makes me wanna punch someone right upside the head.

(mib2berlin) #7

Hi, no it is not over.
If you install Window 10 from a downloaded .iso, for example, you can activated it with a valid Windows 7 key. Last time I do this for a customer is only a few weeks ago.
You can also open the .iso file with file explorer and install over your Windows 7, then all your files and settings are taken.

Cheers, mib

(xol) #8

I’ve noticed in this thread that people are annoyed by the win10 updates. What have been the worst cases ?

That certainly is interesting. I wonder if it’s possible to free upgrade from 7 32-bit to 10 64-bit. I would guess yes. Btw do you have any links with instructions (saves me some googling).

2.8 Beta released(29/11/2018)!
(mib2berlin) #9

Hi, 32 to 64 should be possible but I don´t know exactly for Upgrade.
It is no way to upgrade from Home to Pro but this themes understandable.
My instruction I read some time ago was all in German, may as start point search for “microsoft update tool”.
If all went wrong buy a Windows Pro 64 Key for 5€ ;), they are working and legal.

Cheers, mib

(Renzatic) #10

I usually tend to keep ahead of the big bi-yearly version updates, only being caught off guard by the occasional smaller patches that only take about a couple to five minutes and a reboot to install. My personal experiences haven’t been too terrible. Just somewhat annoying.

Though I have seen first hand what happens if you manage to have one of the big updates sneak up on you. A friend of mine has a laptop he only uses on rare occasions. One day he finds he needs it, so he breaks it out, turns it on, and the first thing he sees is that there’s one of those big version updates waiting in the wings. It didn’t give him the option to defer it. He had no choice but to start the upgrade process, and wait for it to do its thing.

Normally, this takes anywhere between 10 to 30 minutes, depending. For some strange, entirely random reason, that particular update took over 5 hours to complete.

So yeah, it can tick some people off, especially if they have immediate need of their machines, only to find they’re locked out from doing anything with it while Windows goes through its now mandated spiel.

(xol) #11

Ok I understand, thanks for the reply :slight_smile:

That sound really annoying. I’d hate to put up with that crap. I’ve had a similar experience years ago with MSE (Microsoft Security Essentials, which has got another name nowadays ?) . After AVG free edition killed my PSU (the fan was running wild), I uninstalled AVG and installed MSE. In the beginning it was fast, light, and didn’t bother me at all. Then 1+ year later it was getting noticable, and eventually it started taking over the machine the first 10-15 minutes.
I googled and many more people had similar problems, without solution provided. I uninstalled and have been running Bitdefender since.

Also 3+ years ago windows update started eating 50% cpu time for f*****g hours and hours every day, and after googling and finding many people without solution provided, I decided to stop the service. Only recently I put it back on full time, and haven’t noticed heavy cpu usage (only for some minutes maximum each time). I guess MS finally decided to fix that.

So I guess I will stay away from win10 (even after 7 updates stop being provided) unitil they fix that. Unless I buy a new machine of course.

(Peetie) #12

I see indeed a lot of people having issues after updates in Windows 10. Partly this could be that some have devices not suitable for Windows 10. (Best way is to check the website of the manufacturer of the pc/laptop to see if they offer drivers for Windows 10). If there are no drivers offered it might happen that at a particular build the drivers cannot deliver what Windows is asking for.

Some parts of Windows 10 are not matured yet, like Windows mail app, Photo’s app, New style of settings (where you cannot copy the text for example).

And Windows is a service now. Still pretty bad is the way you (can’t) have enough control about things like Windows updates. Ok, you have active hours, and you can even switch the service off from the Windows update components like:wuauserv, cryptSvc, BITS, MSIserver.
And probably you would like to turn off periodically services like superfetch, click to run, Windows search. On my device these latter caused 100 diskusage and sometimes on the worst timing you can imagine.

In Windows 10 pro you have more control and like some mentioned, you can defer updates for a long period which is a good idea.

You also will want to add blender to the exlusion to be scanned all the time by Windows Defender Security Center.

Also backup facilities are buggy like file history and making system images. These are not in development anymore and you will want to use 3th party solutions, or just copy past important files to USB-stick / external HD.

Many Windows 10 users also report many issues with drivers after an update. Never update from our of device manager, but via website of manufacturer or your hardware.

I have Windows 10 home now, but I think about upgrading Windows 10 pro, or otherwise another operating system. Lately I was pretty annoyed by superfetch, click 2 run and such services. It feels like “I wish I could use my own pc”

(sundialsvc4) #13

“Computer software like fine wine – let it age.”

Microsoft has made things very, very difficult for its user community by trying to make updates automatic and compulsory. If you want to do this, it should of course be easy to do. But the Windows ecosystem consists of many b -illions of lines of source code: it is impossible for any software engineering team to keep bugs from creeping into it. Instead, we know that this will happen constantly.

On my Macintosh, I quickly learned to turn off most parts of “Spotlight search” because it was bringing my old computer with its physical disk-drive to its knees, and consuming CPU time that I needed to use for rendering. I also want to be informed that a new OS or application update is available for installation, but for reasons that are important to “me, the owner of the machine (or phone),” I don’t want them to happen automagically. I need to choose when they happen, and to know what they’re made of. I don’t want to be another one of those people bitching on forums the next day after some update got pushed. :slight_smile:

In my mainframe days, IBM actually shipped a “patch tape” (everything was reel-to-reel tape in those days) which would have “bricked” the system had it been installed. Our CE (= Customer Engineer, = IBM Rep) called us up in a panic. I simply informed him that most of the time IBM was just supplying us with scratch-tapes: we stayed a couple months behind on every update, specifically to protect against what actually happened. Microsoft, these days, doesn’t want to give its customers the option to do that, and I think that’s a very un-wise business decision for them to make.

(dgorsman) #14

There have been repeated problems with “Creators updates” being pushed and crippling various applications. Even though I haven’t heard anything for a while there’s still the reputation and the possibility.

MS is in something of a catch-22 with the update system. On the one hand, there are users who don’t want the auto-updates and that would be fine… if they didn’t also complain that their OS is out of date and updates need to be “easier”. On the other hand there are those who want the updates immediately without any bother, and that would be fine… if they didn’t also complain that it interrupts their work and they don’t have any control over it. It’s a matter of choosing one evil or the other. Or try something else and have both groups complaining.

(sundialsvc4) #15

It really isn’t that difficult. If you want it to, Apple’s system can automagically apply updates … at about 2:00 AM. Just leave your computer plugged-in to external power and accessible to the Internet.

But the key word here is, “if.” You still have a choice.

Apple will inform you that a new operating-system release is available to you (at no charge), but it won’t undertake to upgrade your system to it unless you want to.

As for me, I wait several months. I was working inside “One Infinite Loop” during the OS/X Lion days, and I saw the pressure that was on the team to release before “dub dub dee cee” – the Apple WWDC = World-Wide Developers Conference. I was also privy to the outstanding-bugs list. And, although they of course churned right through that list like a team of well-seasoned developers can do, I frankly saw no reason to “install on the release date,” knowing that a surge of “dot-X updates” would very immediately and inevitably follow.

It’s been too-many years since I’ve been inside Redmond for me to speculate what the politics inside of there might be now.

(Renzatic) #16

To be somewhat fair, MS doesn’t release their latest Windows revs all at once on an unsuspecting populace. They stagger them out over time, releasing them in chunks, correcting any bugs that are found, then repeat until everyone has access to the newest version. On top of that, they have the Insider program, where anyone can sign up to beta all the latest features.

It’d be a great way to test for bugs and whatnot, if it weren’t for the fact that MS decided to nix nearly their entire Q&A staff, instead opting to crowdsource their entire testing apparatus. It’s lead to a situation where beta testing is like a popularity contest. The most prevalent bugs get the most attention, while the bugs that don’t effect a lot of people get shuffled to the bottom of the list, and ignored by the dev team.

…at least until release day, when that once rare bug ends up effecting a lot more people, and suddenly everyone’s screaming for blood. That’s what happened with this most recent update. Somehow, a little bug that ended up deleting your entire user folder managed to make its way through the Insider program uncommented upon, but attacked loads of regular, just-want-to-use-my-computer type people who suddenly had to contend with it when the update swung their way.

It’s all kinds of dumb.

(<== Lost? Click Me) #17

Can confirm also.

  1. Before (optionally) nuking the old Windows install use getosstate.exe from the Win10 iso to create a genuineticket.xml on your old Windows (Win7 or newer).
  2. Save the xml to a portable drive.
  3. Do your Win10 install.
  4. Copy the xml to the appropriate folder in the Win10 install:
    C:\ProgramData\Microsoft\Windows\ClipSVC\GenuineTicket\ (xml goes here)
  5. Connect to the internet so MS servers can activate the Win10 install.
  6. Activate via slui.exe on CMD or Powershell (think I did slui -3, or slui -4).

Don’t take too long (weeks) or change major hardware before activation as the genuineticket.xml may be invalidated. Installing to a new and or blank HDD / SSD was ok for me.

(xol) #18

Thanks for the hints. I only backup data of a very few applications when needed, and that manually.
I’ve also been considering another OS (some GNU/Linux distro), the only thing that has stopped me migrating is ABI instability plague of the userland and the kernelland.

I wonder if there is any nice distro whose repository apps are bundled with their dependencies (excluding frameworks/toolkits/etc which don’t break ABI within same major version).

(Dorro) #19

Blender is monolithic and is compiled to include dependencies and the zip installation has never failed me on the innumerable distros I have installed on many hardware combinations over many, many years and have recycled many laptops as gifts for friends. Using Deepin at the moment because I like bling and currently reside in China. The ability to run your distro from bootable USB will allow you to check hardware compatibility out the box, the Linux kernel has far better support for older hardware than the later Windows and the need to use the CLI is a myth on any modern distro. Your older GPU should also be better supported, you can use a bootable USB with persistence to install latest graphic drivers to check, without having to touch your current OS install.


Currently my go to applications are OpenSCAD, Blender and Godot.

(xol) #20

My AIO dependency bundling requirement applies to all applications, not just blender.
Also, what GPU do you use, and if nvidia, I’m assuming you’re using the proprietary ones ?