Newtek (Lightwave) has just been bought by Vizrt

Lightwave is the only app where an indie version would make sense for a moderate price of 199,99$
I dont know its past nor every cool feature it might have deep inside, i just know that when i open it, i feel a puke feeling and get nightmares that i am working in DOS again.
It just look and feel awful,weird,unintuitive and the best, newtek cant manage to bring DISC ROTATION into modeler, what a joke Lightwave has become.

While everything you said is true you have to remember many people have a great amount of affection for LW as it gave many of us a start. I imagine most of the LW brigade are hobbyists and former pros doing the nostalgia thing and they are prepared to overlook the glaringly obvious issues it has. As you can see from the thread owning LW is also a reason to join a forum and talk endlessly about it and reminisce about the good ol’ days.

It’s ridiculously over priced for what it is and there seems to be more work going into Blender on a daily basis than a year of updates for LW. That should tell the user base all they need to know.

I have great memories of LW, but now it’s like watching an old friend die.

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The irony is. Even if you don’t like Modo, that is where LightWave went. And it is a taboo subject that people at NewTek don’t like to talk about. Like Core. Like Rob Powers leaving. Like going silent for two years. Like saying nothing ever again and just releasing LightWave once a year.

So for me it is simply like a division. One fork of the road was LightWave that became Modo. Like it or not but it thrived and prospered. The other fork remained as LightWave and died a slow death.

LightWave was only a moniker after that. More like a misnomer and a false idea it could continue to live and becomes something. A lie perpetrated by the owners who were left with the name and 10 years of useless code. But a userbase who they knew would spend money as long as they could keep up the charade.

The honest thing for NewTek to do would be to simply sell the name for as much as they can and publicly lay it to rest. As it is now they are just stringing people along on a surreal trail of mystery.

I say they owe it to the community to simply get honest and stop giving people false hope, give it an EOL date and move on.

Wind River … 2017
Iron Man … 2008
The Big Bang Theory
Green Book … 2018
Iron Sky … 2012
The Walking Dead
Batman Ninja … 2018

+200 games / movies / series i’d say LightWave is doing alright,
sure, it would be nice to see it at the very top again.

Yeah I know it is amazing how much of a footprint that LightWave still has in the VFX industry.

For those that did not live it. And I am sure there are many here. LightWave was basically to us then, what Blender is now. In a very similar way.

It was how a lot of people got into the VFX industry. And it was a thriving growing and expanding line of work. Basically LightWave carved out a place in the industry.

And Blender, in its own way has done to the 3D software industry what LightWave did to the VFX industry. It was sort of the equalizer. And it meant so many people could enter who would never have been able to before. Blender has done the same for a lot of people.

However. LightWave’s days are over when you consider that it has no modern tools and workflows to attract new artists in the way apps like Blender and Houdini or even Modo.

For LightWave to survive it needed to have transparency and show young people where it was going and keep the long time users inspired. Because it was going to take a long time for those tools to come. And just when it looked like we were going to see some of that transparency they shut it all down.

So it is not really a matter of is it still being used. It is vital to any software to attract new young users and the next gen of artists. That is the relm of Blender now. It was once the relm of LightWave and then Maya. And Maya now even still rules. But LightWave is not in the picture at all. It is all but forgotten. Just quietly churning out product in the background while NewTek milks what it can from those old users.

Nothing can survive long without a lifeline from young users.

And that reality makes me even more angry at NewTek. And shows how strong LightWave was, that it has taken so long to kill it off. And it seems from their actions that this is the intent.

If it walks like a duck as they say…

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Anywhere other than the LW community that would be satire @erikals. You forgot Avatar!

I hope more of the LW community stray over here to this thread and while they’re here I urge them to take a look at https://developer.blender.org/ and look at the plans for Blender and the incredible rate of work that’s going on every single day. There’s no years of radio silence it’s all open, honest, warts and all communication. You can see where Blender is heading and you can watch features added and bugs get fixed in real-time.

There are two applications today that give me the same excitement as I had back in the early days of LightWave, Houdini and Blender. That feeling that the devs have got your back and aren’t just doing the work as a job they’re passionate about what they’re doing and that genuine feeling of excitement for the new release, those feelings have long since evaporated over at Newtek.

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Seriously Erik, both wind river and the Green Book had a few shots(some snow done in Wind River-very good movie by the way and important topic about missing and murdered indigenous women) done with LW and it was by the same artist who still uses Lw. And Walking Dead hasn’t had any LW in it since season 1 which was a decade ago.

not sure where you get your facts from steve, but stargate studios were using Lightwave until around 2017, its only the last couple of seasons things started to switch, they have lightwave showreals and news articles about welcoming and featuring lightwave 2015, they also have a freelance database where many users still use lightwave for shots, even on new shows like treadstone.

I hope more of the LW community stray over here to this thread and while they’re here I urge them to take a look at https://developer.blender.org/ and look at the plans for Blender and the incredible rate of work that’s going on every single day.

I know you’re not suggesting that LW users have had their head under a rock for the 20+ years that Blender and Houdini have existed. However, there have been many oddly placed software invitations tossed at LW users on the NT forums. I can count on my hand the very small number of crayon-chewing, clueless LW users that are unaware of Blender or Houdini …and could actually make use of this “new” information.

I contribute to Blender development but I do most of my work in LW. It is good to see Blender finally being useful and management that can grow it. It is also interesting to see some innovative, disruptive and exploitative business coming from it. That will keep artists on their toes.

not sure where you get your facts from steve, but stargate studios were using Lightwave until around 2017

Not to further dash Steve’s propaganda of doom, some employees there still claim to be using LW.

I don’t understand the silly scorecard element of this discussion. We use whatever tool that gets the job done. I have absolutely no need to know if the tools I use are winning a popularity contest.

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funny as wwhen I googled it the 2018 showreal reply thread also talks of lightwave, then it occurred to me, the LA studio is literally around the corner from newtek, so wouldn’t it make sense to use a product that you can go and have face to face support with, probably why FOX and Discovery still use it as well.

And how is the track record for Blender in TV shows and In movies? …historicly and today, I honestly do not know since I haven´t followed it in the same way as with Lightwave, what shows or movies has it impacted on today?

Personally I started to look at blender in 2015-2016 …but it was hard for me to use because I loathed the UI, it took me many times of opening it for some minutes…only to close it due to how the workflow was structured, that never happened to me when I started with lightwave…I felt right at home in how it worked.

But apart from blender actually changing for the better, I also got through that threshold and can now work with it without the same nautia I got the first times.

Cageman from massive cinematics is praising Lightwave loudly for it´s render nodes, and how they could complete a series of shots with a decent cost, and with a quality the director was more than pleased with…

Quoting "Oh and yes… we use LW renderengine as well… Yesterday afternoon we rendered a 2600 frames animation in about 3-4 hours (LW2019.1.4) on 25 CPUs… 2252x940 resolution. Today, our Director said "This is more than perfect… I didn’t expect this quality for the time given for the shot… "

https://www.youtube.com/user/PrometheusPhamarus/videos

I used LW heavily in production during 2019.
I made over 100 + Tutorials for Blender and a few scripts
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCiy-QcXrvu9hhe4arymNcfw
and I sit in houdini hangout nearly every night.

it boils down to this … use the tools you have.

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THEE track reckord, you can go on and debate it´s later track reckord, but I am sure it is still used…
Since erikals gathered short list doesn´t tell much really, but the interesting part is probably about what it does on the shows or movies, and how it fits in to a pipeline with other tools.

Lightwave Feature Films

  1. 1. 300
  2. 3000 Miles to Graceland
  3. 3. A.I.: Artificial Intelligence
  4. A Sound of Thunder
  5. Avatar
  6. 6. Batman Begins
  7. 7. Battle of Red Cliff (awesome Chineese epic)
  8. 8. Black Hawk Down
  9. 9. Black Knight
  10. Blade
  11. Blade 2
  12. Blade: Trinity
  13. Blood Diamond
  14. Blues Brothers 2000
  15. Bones
  16. 16. Brotherhood of the Wolf
  17. Bunraku
  18. Deep Blue Sea
  19. Deep Impact
  20. Defiance
  21. Devil’s Advocate
  22. Die Another Day
  23. 23. Dogma
  24. Dracula 2000
  25. Dungeons and Dragons
  26. Eagle Eye
  27. Elektra
  28. Enigma
  29. Fantastic Four
  30. Final Destination
  31. Final Destination 2
  32. Final Fantasy
  33. Finding Nemo
  34. From Dusk Till Dawn 2
  35. Ghost Rider
  36. Ghost in the Shell 2: Innocence
  37. Gladiator
  38. Goldeneye
  39. Gothika
  40. Green Lantern
  41. Gulliver’s Travels
  42. Halloween: Resurrection
  43. Harry Potter 3: Prisoner of Azkaban
  44. Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix
  45. Hellboy
  46. His Dark Materials: The Golden Compass
  47. I Am Number Four
  48. 48. I, Robot
  49. 49. Iron Man
  50. Jane Goodall’s Wild Chimpanzees (Imax)
  51. Jason X
  52. Jimmy Neutron, Boy Genius – Oscar Nominee
  53. Jumper
  54. Jurassic Park
  55. Jurassic Park III
  56. K19 The Widow Maker
  57. 57. Kate and Leopold
  58. 58. Kung Fu Hustle
  59. Lara Croft Tomb Raider
  60. Lara Croft Tomb Raider 2: Cradle of Life
  61. Legally Blonde 2: Red, White, and Blonde
  62. Legend of Zorro
  63. Lord of Illusions
  64. 64. Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King
  65. Lost in Space
  66. Master of Disguise
  67. Memoirs of a Geisha
  68. Men in Black
  69. Miami Vice
  70. Mission Impossible III
  71. Monster House
  72. Monsters, Inc.
  73. Mortal Kombat II: Annihilation
  74. Mr. & Mrs. Smith
  75. Mr. Brooks
  76. My Favorite Martian
  77. Nanny McPhee
  78. Nim’s Island
  79. Nixon
  80. No Good Deed
  81. O Brother, Where Art Thou?
  82. Octopus
  83. Old Dogs
  84. Oliver Twist
  85. Pan’s Labyrinth
  86. Panic Room
  87. Paycheck
  88. Peter Pan
  89. Phantoms
  90. Pirates of the Caribbean: The Curse of the Black Pearl
  91. Pirates of the Carribean: At World’s End
  92. Pitch Black
  93. Poseidon
  94. Public Enemies
  95. Queen of the Damned
  96. Race To Space
  97. Racing Stripes
  98. Red Corner
  99. Red Planet

100.Repo Men

101.Rollerball

102.Rules of Engagement

103.S.W.A.T.

104.Scary Movie

105.Scary Movie 2

106.Scary Movie 4

107.Scooby Doo

108.Seabiscuit

109.Serenity

110.Shakespeare in Love

111. Sherlock Holmes: A Game of Shadows

112.She’s Out of My League

113.She’s the Man

114.Shipping News

115. Sin City

116. Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow

117.Skyfall

118.Something Borrowed

119.Spawn

120.Spider-Man

121.Spider-Man 2

122.Sprung

123.Spy Kids

124.Star Kid (aka The Warrior of Waverly Street)

125.Star Trek (J.J. Abrams Version)

126.Star Trek: Nemesis

127.Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country

128.Star Wars Epsiode II: Attack of the Clones

129. SteamBoy

130.Superman Returns

131.Supernova

132.Syriana

133. Tale of the Mummy

134.Teeth

135.Terminator 3: Rise of the Machines

136.The Adventures of Pluto Nash

137.The Astronaut’s Wife

138.The Avengers

139.The Aviator

140.The Big Hit

141. The Cell

142.The Chronicles of Narnia: The Voyage of the Dawn Treader

143.The Core

144.The DaVinci Code

145. The Dark Knight

146.The Day after Tomorrow

147.The Dust Factory

148. The Fifth Element

149.The Flight of the Phoenix

150.The Guardian

151.The Hot Chick

152.The Italian Job

153.The Jackal

154.The Kite Runner

155.The Last Mimzy

156.The Last Samurai

157.The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen

158.The Manchurian Candidate

159. The Matrix Reloaded

160. The Matrix Revolutions

161.The One

162.The Others

163.The Perfect Score

164. The Pianist

165.The Ruins

166.The Siege

167.The Sixth Day

168. The Thomas Crown Affair

169.The Time Machine

170. The Triplets of Bellville

171.The Woman in Black

172.The World Is Not Enough

173.Thunderbirds

174.Titanic – Visual Effects Oscar Winner

175.Torque

176.Toy Story 2

177. Training Day

178. Tropic Thunder

179.Undercover Brother

180.Underdog

181.Van Helsing

182.Waterworld

183.We Were Soldiers

184.Winx – The Secret of the Lost Kingdom

185.Wishmaster

186.X2

187.X-Men

188.X-Men 3: The Last Stand

189.X-Men: First Class

190.xXx

Here is a bit more information:

lw-title

Film.

Hollywood blockbusters are now touting the power and influence of 3D graphics . And the demand for artists to create these mind-blowing visual effects is growing. LightWave™ has the modeling and rendering capabilities to make it a key player in the production pipeline of major motion pictures . Movies such as She’s Out of My League, Avatar , Cargo, Battle for Terra , Angels and Demons, Dark Knight , 300, Iron Man , Serenity, and Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban, all host graphic aspects created in LightWave.

LightWave also works seamlessly with other 3D applications and compositing programs to deliver results . Open formats include support for COLLADA™ and FBX® , MDD , and integrated Autodesk® Geometry Cache . You now have a more streamlined integration process. You can develop accurate models, quickly. Access free and unlimited render nodes . Get more speed and higher quality . Now, go make movies, my friend.

https://www.youtube.com/user/PrometheusPhamarus/videos

and was that list actually missing Battlestar Galactica…which Dj lithium Kelly the Kat worked on as well?

And for anyone saying, you can´t live on old merits, well do you throw your CV in to the garbage can and just show up with your Good looks for the appliance to a job? some historical track on being proven to work in many fields and in many showcases is needed.

https://www.youtube.com/user/PrometheusPhamarus/videos

Users can customize the colors of the UI to their liking. Yes the overall interface still retains much of it’s original overall look and design but it has received some updates over it’s lifetime. It lacks the flexibility in UI customization that other programs like Modo have. If it’s icons that make software pleasing to the eye for you than Lightwave isn’t for your eyes.

As long as you guys dragging out the scorecard are willing to accept that this is the house that Stewart and Allen built and that they did such a good job that LightWave is still being used based primary on that 20 year old tech then you have the proper context for this discussion. In my opinion.

It does nothing at all to refute or rebuke the facts of what has happened to LightWave under NewTek management and now the hand off to Vizrt.

And more importantly posting this won’t save LightWave from NewTek’s self-destructive path for this great tool you decide to still support.

In fact, that there are still people coming out for LightWave proves what a great tool it once was.

It is not there technically anymore.

It does not matter your opinion on that unfortunately. The world outside of the LightWave inner circle has moved on.

Further, and this has been true forever, is that the largest production houses know this. And they have always used LightWave alongside other tools such as Maya for animation.

The question is can LightWave continue to coast on fumes.

I say no. Because NewTek is on a destructive path and because the next gen of artists won’t adopt it.

That should concern you. And don’t kill the messenger

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LightWave 2018 had 20000 people watching online at the NT forum at launch.

LightWave 2020 is around the corner.

not saying LightWave equals the holy grail, but I think some of you are using a too dark filter.


Definitely. I agree. Guilty as charged.

Now can you admit to the possibility that you are using a far to light filter in the face of all the reasons you should do otherwise?

I could be wrong.

How about you?

Thought about it?

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There’s no need to think about this as deeply as some have. You would be just as well to debate which OS someone should be using.

It is endlessly amusing that some people feel the need to be a “messenger”. There’s probably some serious trauma wrapped up in these lengthy rants.

Get a puppy. Give it love. As great as these tools are, no software deserves so much emotional investment.