Compositing Node TypesIf you find major errors please be sure to tell us on the appropriate talk page.
Also there are still some undocumented parts here and there (especially when it comes to Vector nodes) so if s/b can fill in here we would be grateful.
Nicely done, there are a few sections that need better explanations (or corrected ones, like the geometry or the normal node, which doesn’t make sense for me).
I do have massive crits though:
you don’t supply any examples. It’s like a cook book without recipes, only explaining the ingredients.
Everyone can read, or can’t they? To tell you have this and that node without telling whatfor doesn’t make much sense.
Let’s take a look at two examples:
-> how to use an uv-mapped texture with nodes?
-> what does the dot-product do? Well, it generates viewing angle dependent materials, but how can I get it to work?
Hard to tell from the documentation. You should also explain the correspondances between the “old” material system and the new node system.
Sorry if this sounds somewhat harsh. Keep up the otherwise good work!
Yeah, that’s exactly what we don’t know enough to write about it :-/ I at least do mostly the style-part of this rewrite (dunno how indeep Roger’s knowlege is). At least the rewritten pages are now easy to navigate and read (in contrast to the previous ones) … it’s a start.
I do have massive crits though:
you don’t supply any examples. It’s like a cook book without recipes, only explaining the ingredients.
Everyone can read, or can’t they? To tell you have this and that node without telling whatfor doesn’t make much sense.
Examples: Yes, at least a few (short & compact) examples just need to be provided for each functionality in the pages above. Otherwise nobody will profit from them. And further (mroe complex) examples should be made available in the Tutorials section IMHO. But this needs some major knowledge which i’m just learning, so if nobody jumps in to help this’ll take quite some time.
Let’s take a look at two examples:
-> how to use an uv-mapped texture with nodes?
-> what does the dot-product do? Well, it generates viewing angle dependent materials, but how can I get it to work?
That’s what i want to know as well. Please everybody who reads this, we (the blender people) need you :).
Hard to tell from the documentation. You should also explain the correspondances between the “old” material system and the new node system.
Good idea, as far as i know this hasn#ät been explained anwhere in the wiki yet.
Sorry if this sounds somewhat harsh. Keep up the otherwise good work!
Not at all, critique is always welcome. Keep it (and possible enhancements) coming.
Thanks for the links, i know of them already The first one is already linked to in the “Node Composition” page (we might need to integrate it compeltely) and the 2. and 3. are referenced/linked by in the small gray boxes (reference boxes) in “Composition Node Types” and “Material Node Types” pages.
I know that there currently is still some redundant text in there, but this is one thing that really needs to be made better in the future.
Did you like the examples I gave for the RGB Curves? In the Compositing Node section, how about the Time node, the Using Input Nodes subsection, the Compositing Mix example subsections? The whole RenderLayer and Vector Blur sections are examples…do they read well to you?
As far as explaining how the old mat and the node mat is different, we wrote:
In addition to creating materials as just described using all the settings on all the materials panels, Blender allows you to create a material by routing basic materials through a set of nodes. Each node performs some operation on the material, changing how it will appear when applied to the mesh, and passes it on to the next node. In this way, very complex material appearences can be achieved.
I will begin by saying that the node system does not make the material pane obsolete. Many features and material settings are still only accessible through the material panel (e.g. Ray Mirror). However with the advent of nodes, more complex and fantastic materials can be created since we now have greater control. So let’s begin with a normal material (Links and Pipeline tab).
Here we have the standard material we have added to a cube mesh. I could, as I have in the past, add color and other settings to this material and it would certainly look nice. But let’s say I am just not getting what I am looking for? What if I what to control the creation more tightly or add more complexity? Here is where nodes come in.
Making this node map is accomplished by working in a Node Editor window
While I haven’t had a chance to look over the docs yet, I think it is great that someone is doing this.
I wrote a brief primer on using nodes for compositing which has since got buried in the tutorials threads (here it is: http://members.dodo.com.au/iaina/BlenderNodePrimer.pdf), and I was asked to make a wiki page with the info, which I said I’d do, but then all these things started happeneing (exams, new baby, moving house: lame excuses I know!).
Feel free to use any of the info in the mannual I wrote (mention my name somewhere in despatches if you feel so inclined…) and if you want a text copy of it, send me a PM with your email and I’ll chuck you one.
It is still my plan to make a document of a full VFX shot as a tutorial and upload it, using blender of course for 3D and comping, but it could be a while off yet.
Excellent affort again
I’m gonna read the docs now.
Yes, examples are obviously lacking & WIP, but if you stumble upon ndoe-setups (especially simple ones) don’t hestitate to mention it here. We’ll try to include it into the manual or tutorial section - depending on its compexity.
Oh, just to make this link-collection complete, here are some more node-related links to the wiki (Tutorials):
I haven’t had time to look over the Wiki too closely in quite some time … but I often find that the most glaring weakness in technical documentation is at the beginning. In other words…
In very simple non-technical language, completely devoid of “jargon” and of references to other pages … sit down, pour us a beer or a nice cup of coffee, and simply tell me: what are “nodes?” What are they for? How does Blender use them, and why on earth would I want to use them in my project?"
Then, once I’m on board with that, dazzle me just a little: show me a simple example of how they are “insanely great,” to help give me a push through the long hours of reading that are to follow.
Sundial: that’s exactly what I tried to do with Compositing. In very layman’s terms, what is it, what do people do with it, what of some examples of it, what are the tools I can use (the nodes) and then some examples for each one indiviually and the for node sets (blur background, photo enhancement). Now, that’s what i wanted to do…did I?
I fully agree, a very simple & clear introduction helps a lot when advancing into the more detailed steps.
If i were more skilled in english phrasing (I’m more a staep-by-step guy) i would try to do some modifications to the introduction chapters of each segment.
For the basic description nodes we would need an easy to use analogy in the real world. An analog device or institution that takes something in, processes them with given parameters and gives the result away. Like a factory or an ofen or something. What doi you think?
The second thing I really want to have documented is why certain nodes look the same in material-nodes and composition-ndoes and have basically the same function but behave differently internal - leading to some strange behaviour sometimes.
IIRC e.g. the vector (blue) connectors in the compositior contain real normal maps (e.g bitmaps) and the ones in the material-nodes use some sort of internal vector representation. This is all if i got it right - see it needs documentation How do we explain that? And following this example: how do image-connectors/sockets behave in the two node-editors?
I found an error. On the Manual/Node Editor page, under the “Node Editor Window Actions” subheading, you have the line “Alt-Z - Undo”. This is incorrect. Undo is Ctrl-Z. You could also put in that Ctrl-Shift-Z is Redo.
I think that the “big-picture pour-me-a-beer intro” level of detail is still missing. It could be a fairly small section but it does need to be one of the first ones that one might encounter.
Basically, the “four W’s”… what are “nodes,” where do they fit into the Blender system, why and when do I use them?
The purpose of this introductory section is not to explain any particular feature of the nodes system, nor of any dialog that is related to them. Rather, it is to “set the stage” for understanding the system at the highest possible level of abstraction.
The way that I try to wrap my head around the idea of “nodes” is to think of them as being some kind of representation of the processing workflow within the blend: nodes that generate stuff, other nodes that filter their inputs and do something with them, and so on, finally winding up at a consumer that is the final result… And it puts all that complexity out into a very visual format, so that you can look at it. “The head-bone is connected to the neck-bone” and all of that.
How do we explain that? And following this example: how do image-connectors/sockets behave in the two node-editors?