Bart (from blendernation in case you don’t know!) said that the animation challenges are specific to the blenderartists forums, so there’s not much use in asking blendernation readers for input… But he did say that for the next challenge we should write a good invitation for blendernation readers to enter.
Sounds good!
@bupla: Lip-sync doesn’t take a HUGE amount of time if it’s only for a short voice clip - there’s the 11 second club which is a monthly character animation challenge that often (if not always) uses voice clips… I think we should do different things each month (4 weeks is more or less a month :p) though, i.e. not lipsync EVERY month, so that if people don’t really want to do lipsync they can just wait for next month’s challenge… Also having different types of animation each month it makes it less mundane I think.
Perhaps it would be interesting to do a series of “acting” challenges, for example one could be to show the character’s reaction to hearing some really bad news/good news/exciting news.
Maybe for this next mid-november challenge we should choose a topic that allows for some comedy (but nothing too obscure!) to attract more people to enter, e.g. “Running away from imaginary attackers” or something…
Thanks leojS for the information. When I have everything in place I will probably make an announcement here in News Discussion. I will also move the challenge to the contest subforum and not anymore in the weekly challenge subforum as that is definetly not the correct place for a contest that runs for 4 or more weeks.
I think for the upcoming challenge I will choose a topic along the lines. Show a funny walk or lift a heavy object.
A few things that also came to my mind:
I think that the ressources to use should be free to decide
I also think it is only fair to allow the people to change the used rigs as they see fit (if one is provided) the only thing I would be asking is to either post the changes in form of a blend file or explain the changes with an explanation and images. After all we all want to learn something.
I would like to make wips mandatory but as the past has shown not a lot of people are to fond of that.
Musk,
I think I agree with Harkyman on this. If you had a standard environment, then the animation challenges are not only good for each round, but they form the basis of the types of exercises that a beginning or intermediate animator might practice on. Have you seen the Animation Mentor newsletter, or some of their practice tasks? Or have you read any of the books by George Maestri? (Character Animation vol 1, 2 and I think now 3)
There is the opportunity to do all kinds of motion studies like: push a block, pull a block, lift object, move a ball etc. And/or more advanced motions, walk cycle, run, skip, hop, as well as emotion studies, walking & sad, happy etc.
If you are interested in creating a blend file with resources as harkyman sugested, I think I can commit to that since it would be a short term commitment to establish a basic file, perhaps linked to several resources. PM me if this sounds interesting.
I also think there should not be sound. Unless you’re working with lip sync, sound is usually put in later to follow animation. Also, a good animation should be able to convey the story with the audio muted.
I understand that you want people to be free to use their own resources (model, rig, etc.), but let me make an argument for the other case:
Having a standard setup increases the ability of people to say “Yes, I have a few hours – I’m going to do it this time.”
Having a standard setup drastically increases the “judge-a-bility” of the finished works. The only thing separating them will be the quality of the animation. It insulates people from thinking that their animation got the shaft because someone else’s models had wicked normal maps.
When you’re working on a one person (or two person) project, you do everything: model, rig, light, script, etc. However, in a production environment, you’re more likely to just, say, animate. And while you might give some feedback to riggers during the development process, you’re going to be animating with what comes down the pipeline.
Doing it this way creates a limited but focused challenge, and one that I think a lot of people will go for. Of course, you could change it up as the circumstances demanded. For example in a challenge for the character to carry something heavy up the stairs, then meet disaster, you could say to use the standard file with the freedom to include one additional prop. Someone might model an anvil. Someone else might grab a model of a tractor trailer and have it careen up the stairs.
Anyway, the point is that even within a standardized format there is freedom. In fact, I’ve found that the more constraints you place on artists, the better their output is. If you give them complete freedom, they waste their time making all kinds of weird decisions. If you lay down the rules and boundaries, they can start working right away.
Totally agreed with Harkyman, strict limits will enable more people to participate if the goal is to judge the animation part. Simple exercises (in their brief) like the ones in Animation Mentor are very pertinent.
I remember a BA thread not long time ago where the goal was to model something with 10 cubes, no more, and it was a huge success, in participation and creativity.
@musk: Sounds great! In case you didn’t see the article on blendernation… a new rig has been released from a project that the company Matt Ebb (Elephants Dream) works for is working on called Kajimba, it can be downloaded here: http://www.kajimba.com/index.php?p=characters&c=bill
The character is a Bilby and the rig has squash and stretch features, so it should be useful for comical animations!
@harkyman: If this were to be done, I don’t think it should be a requirement to use the pre-prepared scene - allowing people to make their own setups encourages more creativity in my opinion… I also think that it’s probably too much work to maintain a scene, that is unless you keep the topics very limited (of which people could get bored!). As for your 3rd argument, I don’t suppose a lot of modelling is required especially if the topic is just something like “lift a heavy object”. I mean all you really need is a box, as the focus of the challenge is on animation. It might be an idea to make a “basic materials only” requirement to keep the contest based solely on the animation, or we could go as far as only allowing viewport renders…
I agree with Harkyman’s ideas. I find I nearly always get bogged down in playing with materials, or other niggling, though interesting, details. I learn a few things along the way, but not animation. As a result, I begin to make an animations for the challenges, but don’t finish most of them.
Whenever I’ve taken a college level class in art, including animation, the best and most creative output is always from assignments with restrictions. This is true for all of the students in the classes.
my 2 cents,
Animation is very time consuming, so you’re fighting against that fact. My suggestion is not to make the challenge shorter (10 seconds is nothing and almost not worth it because of that), but to make the challenges simpler and more specific (ie, here is a file for a very simply rigged ball with eyeballs and a scene with a few items in it, animate the ball moving from point A to B). Right now you’re asking someone to do a modeling, rigging, rendering, and animation challenge all in one when the focus should just be animation (even though you’re allowing previously made items and open source items, they still have to put everything together).
Also, I think making the challenges last longer might be working against you if you’re not advertising them consistently.
Right now you’re asking someone to do a modeling, rigging, rendering, and animation challenge all in one
There are plenty of links provided in each challenge to pre-rigged characters that people can use - so you don’t need to model anything… and seeing as it’s an ANIMATION challenge - you don’t even really have to set up any complex lighting or rendering or anything; you could go as basic as just rendering from the viewport…
Seeing as this has come up several times, maybe in needs to be made clearer in the challenges that the focus is on ANIMATION, so rendering, lighting, cool shaders, etc don’t matter at all.
I agree that having a scene already set up for people to use would be useful, but definitely shouldn’t be made compulsory.
@musk: Any news on when the next challenge will start?
Maybe every second or so animation, make it something other than character animation - particles, fluids, a vehicle moving or something similiar?
Quoted for total agreement. I’d say switch between character animation and object/physics animation. That way it can be like, “This month is character animation, but I want to do object, so next month I can do it.” kind of deal. A set routine.
And I see a lot of the people you commented, don’t know how the challenge was run. I suggest going and looking at the old ones before comment. Like those who said, “you don’t have time for everything”, I say go and look at the old ones, the competitors, for the most part, used already done rigs, i.e. ManCandy. There even was a list of places to download rigs. It wasn’t mandatory, but available for use. people didn’t even always make an environment, because it wasn’t looked at as far as picking a winner. Purely animation.
I’m so excited for this, I can’t barely stand it. Please Musk, I’ve been waiting nearly 2 1/2 months!
I’m on it!
I just switched projects at my workplace so I do not have as much time as I did before but I’m already in the making. If everything goes to plan I’m going to go life next weekend.
It will be a character animation and probably something simpler like lift a heavy object. But do not get started yet as I’m still in figuring out how to organize it trying to incorporate the input given here.
Another reason why I want to start a little bit late is because of the blending life contest which will take away lot’s of time.
I will announce it on News&Discussion and the contest will be held in the contest sub forum.
So be patients and practice a little.
