Will UPBGE get more stable?

I just modeled and rigged my own cockatoo bird in UPBGE 0.3. The modelling and making of the skeleton went without a hitch and so did vertex paint assigning, but when it came to the parenting of the bones (crest, beak, wings, etc) and selecting them all individually to parent, oh my gosh, the crashing was immense! It just crashed nonstop, and I had to recover the file again and again. Eventually, I got all the bones correctly parented, but this nonstop crashing really infuriates me at times. I do have a question - when is UPBGE going to get more stable? I know time will make UPBGE more stable in releases, but 0.3 is crash-happy in circumstances with a lot of bones, etc. I am no programmer or developer, but UPBGE seems to have a lot of trouble handling bones all right. My Mac does not cause any issues, and Rosetta emulation has nothing to do with it, this seems to be bad lines of code that need to be ironed out, like with the iPhone 1 in 2007. I look forward to later more stable versions of UPBGE. The slowdown seen in rigs when played also seems to be from bad lines of code too…

I am sorry if this turned into a little rant, I tried to keep this as civil and as rule-abiding as possible. I feel frustrated, and I just want a more stable version of the program. I love Blender and UPBGE and would love to see them get more stable as time goes by. There is a saying that time heals everything.

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UPBGE is not maintained, developed, nor funded by the Blender Foundation, so it’s unlikely that a stable version will exist on par with something like Unreal Engine or even Godot. Open source projects of this scale tend to stumble without foundational backing and a significant developer workforce - UPBGE has neither, being both community funded and developed

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We have a stable release, 3.0, and alpha builds,

We don’t change any blender code…

We are a layer added on top of blender,

Frankly this post should be a bug report if there is one.

Comes off as a hit post against upbge.

if you work in UPBGE get crash or error exit - create bug report fro developers, or use UPBGE v.0.2.5 based frome 2.79 blender for stability work

This is because UPBGE 0.3+ has no GPU skinning capabilities, mentioned in this issue. Is there any particular why you don’t use a more modern game engine such as Godot, Unity, Unreal or even Armory? All of them support GPU skinning, in fact, I believe Armory is mentioned as an example in the linked issue. There is a experimental build that @ haidme used in his Krum - Battle Arena game, but it’s still based on legacy versions, unfortunately. The build can be found in the experimental builds folder of the UPBGE MEGA folder I believe.

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Isnt Armory actually another version of Blender Game Engine? Does it support .blend files and python?

I once tried 0.2.5, and it crashed like crazy. I use a 2021 iMac running Rosetta 2.

  • Armory is a Blender Game Engine that was created before UPBGE (proof can be provided on request), but it’s not built on BGE API, which allows a lot more flexibility in core structure (cross-platform exporting, modern features, etc), as well as GPL workarounds. See here.

Absolutely. You can see this best in action at the online Armory3D demos.

  • Blends for demos - here.
  • Build code for demos - here.

Armory3D logic nodes are also fully compatible with web exports.

Back when it Blender legacy was supported, yes. But not anymore for several reasons:

  • Armory3D no longer has 3D Viewport support for Blender 2.8+ versions because of the removal of Blender Internal source - UPBGE had the same problem until the UPBGE 0.3+ the migration, and only then at the cost of performance as you probably are aware of. Armory3D has it’s own external standalone player (like Blenderplayer), built on Krom for cross-platform exporting.
  • Blender’s, BPY API have GPL licenses, as well as for Blender itself.
  • Python is a interpreted programming language, which makes it slower then compiled languages.
    • Armory3D supports several languages as can be seen below. Some of them can also be used interchangeably (e.g. JavaScript → Haxe OR Haxe → JavaScript).

image

List of supported languages here.

Documentation at the Armory3D wiki.

It is a bit confusing that if the question is:

Isnt Armory actually another version of Blender Game Engine?

you answer:

Armory is a Blender Game Engine that was created before UPBGE

The reality is that Armory is a game engine that has a Blender addon to export. UPBGE/BGE (is the same engine) is the only Blender Game Engine.

Regarding GPL workarounds I don’t know how Armory, using bpy in its scripts and sharing place in its repository can do that GPL workarounds.

Anyway, I like Armory engine but it is not necessary these things to promote Armory.

“Blender Game Engine” is a relative term, the definition of it is, “game engine for Blender,” - which Armory is. Blend4Web, Arsenal, and many other forks do not use BGE API but are said to be Blender Game Engines. UPBGE for example is said to be, “Blender itself,” - that is not true, but they use as a relative term. UPBGE is neither in vanilla Blender or sponsored by the Blender Foundation, but could be interpreted that way because it uses Blender’s source. Some may argue that since BGE was removed, the term, “Blender Game Engine,” is no longer specific in any case.

This actually still remains to be undisputed (annoyingly). See here. Except for some raised concerns relating to proprietary binaries as mentioned here, the licenses still remain valid, and even those conflicted licenses could legally lawful if the suggested solution was implemented.

Sorry, I do not understand this English.

He is saying get out of this thread, it’s a upbge thread and you are promoting another engine as a answer.

“Blender Game Engine” is a relative term

No, it isn’t. BGE is an acronimum that means Blender Game Engine → BGE

This actually still remains to be undisputed (annoyingly)

For me is clear. Currently, the armory repository should be GPL.
You can avoid this if you move the armory addon to its own repository and after in the distribution phase you distribute the addon and the armory player in an independent way.

It has to be said though, if the UPBGE guys can take some pages from how the BF or from how the Godot devs. run things, it can become something truly special simply because of the no-pipeline paradigm (ie. the Adobe Flash of game engines).

Accusations like this will only cause people to see UPBGE as a rather weak project that is not going to go anywhere. A good project lead has the ability to differentiate between a baseless hit job and a legitimate complaint from a user who really wants to use the app. and love it.

It actually was common in this community (in the early days) for many to lash out at those who saw Blender as less than perfect, and it took a long time before the Blender userbase was able to shed its reputation of being an emotionally unstable cult who could not handle the truth regarding the app’s current shortfalls.

To bring UPBGE into a respected position, the team needs to take the current complaints seriously and release versions that are at least quite stable with the various features working as advertised. There is a lot of good you can do if that happens since the game industry has long has issues with releasing buggy products and tools.

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Upbge “stable” is 3.0x

Upbge “prototype” is 3.3x

That said, the prototype version tends to be pretty stable even when made in bfcon 2, as we are building based on blender itself, we mostly don’t add any bugs. (we don’t add much except was already added)

very strange - in my PC upbge 0.2.5 work stability, maybe you download version for windows?

I’ve using UPBGE 0.3 couple of weeks now, I use only Blender features and not any game engine specific features and it has not crashed yet. I will experiment game engine features soon and I’m interested to know where are the issues.

I use the Mac version, since I am on a 2022 M1 iMac. Bizarre how macOS apps are meant to be more stable than their PC counterparts, but UPBGE can crash a fair amount, especially with bone editing…

The Blender portion (without UPBGE) is slightly more stable.

Edit: I understand UPBGE is in development - development apps will crash. I do love UPBGE and I am 100% sure that it will eventually get to a stage where it is almost completely crash-free even on Macs (no app is 100% crash-free), which would be beautiful.

This wasnt intended to bash or hit against UPBGE. I love UPBGE, but the crashing I don’t like. It does occasionally crash a bit on Macs, even though the Mac version was built for macOS 10.10+.

Rosetta 2 has nothing to do with the crashes - as Rosetta 2 has a 99% compatibility rate almost.

GPU skinning? Whats that? Are the devs adding that, cause 2.79 had that I believe, as it rarely crashed when editing lots of bones.

I’m also interested to see whether or not later releases of UPBGE like 3.3 will fix the performance impact of rigs ingame. If you have played any 3D game on a console or PC/Mac that is well built, you’ll notice that the rig of the player model (and other models) do not impact performance in the slightest.

Weirdly enough, when I started the aforementioned cockatoo bird in the game engine, it didn’t even slow down much. It was running at near 60fps. I know EEVEE can slow down a lot with armatures due to it being designed for CPU.

Really?! This whole time I thought it was - isn’t itn a fork of the BGE?