yafray and povray

hi

since yafray seems to have no real dev at the moment and aqsis the same i was curious if somebody here has some in depth experience with povray.
i know that there are some export script but i am more intrested in

how shaders transfer

how is the render speed in povray

how do particles etc transfer or what is supported by povray from blender.

claas

i am wondering the same thing.

the povray site has some great quality renderings. megapov has even some more features like dynamics (softbodies) but do you have to code all by hand to access that or is there a povray frontend?

claas

i’ve worked with povray and megapov, but both work inconsistently (they dont always render sorrectly.) must be a computer problem. ill look into it.

when it does render correctly, it does it pretty well, but is about the same speed as yafray, if not a bit faster. but im not positive. it could be quite a bit faster, but due to the inconsistency, and that the blender->povray export script not working for me, its hard to tell.

I’ve used POV for quite a while and then switched to YafRay because of its really good integration into Blender. But now, since YafRay is more or less dead, I’m considering to go back to POV as well. On the other hand, YafRay is still a good raytracer.

I used povanim, an export script wich worked very well, but I’ve never tested it with some later releases of Blender.

another vote for pov integration here (not script, I mean hardcore integration in render panel: btw. tuhopuu team please … ).
-blender text editor could be used to integrate pov code snippets into render command shaders geometry atmosphere normals etc
-pov has been around forever so it’s a survivor
-pov was in space and came back, so it must be cool and will thus work on ubuntu for certain reasons
-new pov is said to support multithreading
-tons of hacks for render/radiosity speedup available on the www
-tons of cool snippits and includes from the www
-jms obviously knows the guts of the process well enough already
-said to be easily compilable as a commandline renderer with mingw on widows (i personally hacked povanim to work nicely with mingw build for me)
-can be compiled with drastic optimizations - which is TheHighestGood™ for desperate cheap hardware owners and those who tend to impress cg chicks.
-who cares if it isn’t os

-there’s a nice tool called poseray for windows - perhaps it can be looked upon for some more inspiration http://mysite.verizon.net/sfg0000/

-FR+++scene preset saving+++

Seem to recall a discussion on that before. Something about licensing issues? Don’t think Povray developers allow for integration into another app. Think our best chances still lie with Aqsis.

for those who worked with the export script how are shaders transfered ?

Right, so what does it matter if it’s being updated or not, it’s still just as good, ain’t it ?

Something about licensing issues? Don’t think Povray developers allow for integration into another app.

NO? what’s this then (integrated raytracer is povray btw.)
and I was talking of integrated +++exporter+++ which could render with a press of a +render+ button from within blender; with certain level of predictability and reliability, as expected from a mature piece of kit.

… licencing issues … sure. plain politics.

i wouldnt be surprised if they maybe licensed povray.

as far as i know this is a light design service and no non-pros play with that.
light design is more than putting some lights to somewhere.

claas

Now I’ve been using POV-Ray for a loooong time before I found blender. It’s a really great ray tracer in my opinion, but the problem is that it’s a very different approach to modelling and shading. It’s much more “physics-inspired” in shading, has a huge library of procedural textures (uv-texturing is a rather recent addition), and, most importantly, works best with solid mathematical primitives, not meshes. So a sphere is really a sphere, not a bunch of triangles shaped roughly like a sphere, and as such e. g. has a clearly defined interior and is smooth at any resolution. Since blender does everything with patch-primitives, half of POV-Ray’s features are already inacessible. Converting textures and shading from blender to POV is a whole other issue, since the texture params and lighting model are very different.

I’ve rarely had instability problems (running on Mac), but sometimes some features don’t render correctly (e. g. always had noise problems with atmospheric media).

The license problem comes from POV being pre-GPL era, they started with a very strict license (e. g. no reuse of code in other apps, no calling of the pov-ray core from other programs, as mentioned) and now they’re stuck with it 'cause the old code is still in there. <EDIT>However, I seem to remember having read something about a complete rewrite (v4.0) quite some time ago (many years)</EDIT> , which should be published with a more “Free Software”-style license. Anyway, this wouldn’t be a problem if blender just generated a SDL text file for POV to render (like it’s done with yafray).

Anyway, considering all those problems, I’m a bit sceptic about the feasability and usefulness of a yafray-like POV-Ray integration in blender.

Now what I’d wish to have is a good export script for individual meshes, so as to do the modelling, posing, uv-unwrapping and stuff in blender, then export and do the scene compositing, lighting, texturing and such in POV using it’s VERY powerful Scene Description Language. This should make it possible to get the best out of both worlds. Still, it’s no replacement for a high-quality ray tracer for blender.

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POV ray was probably the first 3D program I ever tried, like over a decade ago. It seems like a nice raytracer, with alot of resources on the net. I would sure like it if there was an easy way to render directly from within Blender, like with Yafray!
But the whole POVRay philosophy is a bit different, it is a more coder-friendly, “artist-unfriendly” approach, I sure would never want to composite any of my scenes, lets say from 200 objects, in a text editor, let alone texture, light, etc…

About Yafray: anyone have any useable info? I use it for most of my work, as the Blender internal just doesn’t cut it in some respects… I sure hope it will be continued to be developed.

ah ok so than i guess cuse i am on the artist side povray is nothing for my code unfriendly mind set, too bad because the stuff i saw at their website realy impressed me. also the physics in povray are interesting.

claas

Concerning POV: yes, it uses another approach of building scenes, namely a Scene Description Language (SDL), but this doesn’t matter since the povanim script exports a mesh (the format is called ‘mesh2’) wich can be used by POVs render engine without any problems.

Some people asked about YafRay development on the YafRay forum recently, but AFAIK they didn’t get any answer from one of the core developers. This is a shame especially because there’re some really interesting things in the dev pipeline, e.g. a more physical based approach of rendering similar to the maxwell render engine. All I know so far is that the developers have alot of other thing to do atm.