An chance to resolve the problems with hotkeys in Blender 2.8 forever

General Forums Blender Development Discussion
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Hello developers, users and the whole Blender community.
My name is Alexey, and I active user of Blender.
In this post I want to resolve a problem with hotkeys, and confusions in menu, in my lovely Blender 2.8
I do not critique hard work the developers, I really to admire their work.
Developers performed the giant work, and I respect them fot that.
My goal, in the post, just to create something goodish for all Blender community.
And as you already understood from my grammatical errors, English is not native language for me.
But I hope that my grammatical errors do not created a barrier for understanding what I want to say for You.

In the method I have proposed for working with the menu, it is not necessary to make global changes to the structure of Blender. This is just a review of the sorting logic of the menu, plus a minimal addition of functionality.

Well, let’s start:

Large images You can be download at this link in the zip archive -

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1swS3JwZsYWMoWMtG2GaoCmzLFs2jWwkt

Probably not everyone knows that in all the Blender menus there are “second level hot keys ???”

I highlighted them in the screenshot number 1 below.

This is a small underscore under the letter that “begins” a quick call. These letters are not always logical :slight_smile:

IMAGE 1
Full preview https://drive.google.com/open?id=13STOfu3KyTpxpIGYyZv-7SMAwJ3pQsBG

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01922Ă—1219 133 KB

How it work, let see it at UV menu:

press U then press u - Unwrap
press U then press s - Smart UV Project
press U then press l - Lightmap Pack
press U then press f - Follow Active Quads
press U then press c - Cube projection
press U then press p - Sylinder projection
press U then press h - Sphere projection
press U then press v - Project from view
press U then press b - Project from view (Bounds)
press U then press m - Mark seam
press U then press e - Clear seam
press U then press r - Reset

This is an interesting decision, but it is not perfect…

On this screenshots I tried to remove all duplicates, sort the menu actions, grouped them at the value. But I get a fiasco :slight_smile:
So I redid the whole logic of the menu lists. (You can it overview it on the pictures below.)
For example, all actions which have relations to UV menu, have be in the UV unwrap menu. Neither in every others, only in the thematic menu.
Other example, all addons have be in its thematic menu, if the rule is broken, at the final result we have visual mess in menu lists…

IMAGE 2
Full preview https://drive.google.com/open?id=1x4Sd6drSH3iR9r2lLHpA2dzLQbPH8ras

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At the IMAGE 3 I tried to overview, how menus to will be work and how be to look.
The logic of using this method will solve the problem of inventing new key combinations for new functions. And satisfy the opponents of the Pie Menus (yes, there are such people too :).
This input method allows the use of hot keys, and numeric dialing, both separately and mixed.

IMAGE 3
Full preview https://drive.google.com/open?id=1e41q_uoz4bqMH1jZagztzn_esZJOuhjW

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For example, if You want to create bevel on a edge, You press hotkey combination Ctrl+E, after that (menu list is open) You press number 1 (You chose submenu list) and then press 1 again, and after that Your bevel had be created (that is long path =). Or press Ctrl+B :smiley:
You press hotkey combination Ctrl+V, then You press 3, after that press 7, done. (abbreviated record - Ctrl+V 3 7).

I also to plead developers and programmers to create a delay for to appear menu list. The delay have be 1 or 1.5? seconds. This feature must be activated if user very quickly to pressed long hotkeys combinations.
For example, is user pressed U 1 1 (in 1 second period) (U call UVunwrap menu, 1 choose unwrap menu, 1 created an action.
I think user do not need to show flickering menu lists.
For that features we have 3ds max, with own flickering interface =D

I have one more plead for developers. Please create hotkeys for these menus - View, Select, and Mesh. (IMAGES 4, 5, 6)
This feature is very helpful if Blender opened on full screen, and all panels are closed handly.

IMAGE 4
Full preview https://drive.google.com/open?id=1QxkVqPd3K6s9oEDH12d9RUl3q0sKFlcg

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IMAGE 5
Full preview https://drive.google.com/open?id=1_ujnP2A0ciBQPJZW4_RhHUTaRNGF7rmo

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IMAGE 6
Full preview https://drive.google.com/open?id=1xypcF8XLO27_OuEmM3QmhDM7_s4R4Hgl

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I offer the next hotkeys:

Menu View - Ctrl+Alt+V
Menu Select - Ctrl+Alt+S
Menu Mesh - Ctrl+Alt+M

On IMAGES 7, 8, 9 You can see changed menu lists Vertex, Edges, and Faces.

IMAGE 7
Full preview https://drive.google.com/open?id=1WMCvl6OPJZfAKQwNLNd4WoYaAGxAi-nF

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073000Ă—1483 255 KB

IMAGE 8
Full preview https://drive.google.com/open?id=1nebTqbAHR2bXRrPrOifHhXfYUxNbSp5n

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083000Ă—1483 245 KB

IMAGE 9
Full preview https://drive.google.com/open?id=1ELZDdralQKtYPD5Y5a0vYwrvldO8qhSI

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093000Ă—1831 235 KB

On IMAGE 10 You can see changed UV menu

IMAGE 10
Full preview https://drive.google.com/open?id=16ZOnjuQNvtvCh_y6R4TdXJJhtAQoOvj-

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103000Ă—1483 199 KB

IMAGE 11, this is my loved menu (It called SPECIAL, and it called with hotkey W). The menu includes.
It is special menu, that include all often used functions of Blender for manipulate 3d grid. Most of the functions in the menu are duplicates from other menus assembled in one place for the quickest possible call of the necessary functions.

IMAGE 11
Full preview https://drive.google.com/open?id=1nU0nwghhxHO8PH8jcB97pfJQD9vwkRTv

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113000Ă—1744 747 KB

And finally a some small menus. IMAGE 12
EXTRUDE (Alt+E), Manipulations of Vertices Points (Alt+M), DELETE (X)

IMAGE 12
Full preview https://drive.google.com/open?id=1Qr7FIk3lNhiQy45vs8N3BAnxZJQp5E5r

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I really understand that my proposal the developers can to reject. And I have not an illusions about this. Just want to contribute in development the Blender.
Nobody can only take something and did not give something back in return.

In my presentation can be some logical errors. I understand it, I just an people.

With deference Alexey

P.S. If You like this post, please help to transmit this post for Blender developers…

3 Likes
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Pressing numbers 1-0 (alone or with Alt, to get 20 menu accelerators) has been in Blender since the beginning. Is that what you mean? Only missing thing is showing the numbers (pie menus do it) so users don’t have to count and remember.

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Hello, in this post I suggest to logical optimize all menus in Blender. Also I suggest to place all users addon in special submenu… Pie menu is not always convenient. And with the Pie menu very difficult to resolve some things. For an examle, when I want to delete some vertices/edges/faces, I tap the hotkey combination - X 1/2/3. In that action me do not need Pie menu…But If You understood that I talk about, it means that my english is very very bad… :frowning:

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For me the menus are for things I forget the shortcuts for, or for things that I use so little that I don’t care. If I find myself hunting around menus often enough for something then I learn its shortcut or set one up and use it.

1 Like
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I understand that critics can be made to current menus.
But your solution is simply to force two levels of menu for every item.
In your proposal, nothing is reachable without taping at minimum 3 keys.

IMO, it is the opposite goal that should be reached.
If problem is that menus have too many items, solution should be more menus with fewer items.

Items needed is really related to workflow of user.
I prefer default menus that give quick access in 2 keys (although one may not be intuitive) to something I use and contains things that I don’t use.
Sincerely, it it is not a big deal to learn that I have to use a letter that is not capital one.
Favorites menu : a menu that user can define is a new feature that goes into correct direction.

Ideally, any of those default menus should be easily customizable. A user should be able to indicate if he wants to remove an item or add another one not present in default menu.

2 Likes
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Hello.
Thank you for Your opinion.
I do not insist on this decision, it may not be perfect. I’m just trying to make Blender better.
If You, or anybody can to offer the best solution, I will gladly accept it.

Yes, this method really use 3 keys. This is necessary for logical sorting of menu functions. Otherwise the list of menu can be very long. (See IMAGE 1)
IMAGE 1
FULL PREVIEW https://drive.google.com/open?id=1eBB_OjquUQOwydU47r7DrkklaSh-ixfD

answer_1
answer_11553Ă—1842 451 KB

But why did you notice only digital hotkeys? This method does not cancel other hotkeys, for example, Ctrl+Shift+Alt+anykey. And you can perform an action by pressing for example Shift+D. Digital hotkeys are a spare “parachute”. When developers once again decide to change / remove the habitual hotkeys. Do you like to retrain hotkeys?
In this method, the letter combinations of hotkeys can be changed to any (or removed), but numeric ones cannot be changed.
In the current time we have this…(See IMAGE 2)
IMAGE 2
FULL PREVIEW https://drive.google.com/open?id=152_Fa-kzKmJ5cB3f_Eg55cLuWm7Ui8sP

answer_2
answer_21330Ă—986 246 KB

7

You took example of subdivide that has no shortcut. But actually, to subdivide mesh, you just have to do a right click followed by a click or pressing S key.
Your method forces any user to attribute a custom shortcut to Subdivide or pass by a slow 3 keys method with a menu and a submenu for something not as rare as a subdivide.

If menus are longer in 2.8, it is also because devs wanted to avoid as much as possible to require to sub-menus that are slowing process.

That was something that people were often complaining about.
Weird 4 key combinations that can require your 2 hands depending of your keyboard.
2.8 keymap currently did not remove all of them but reduced their amount.

Default keymap is supposed to have less shortcuts to let space for customization.
If some crucial operators are not available in a simple call menu that directly shows the corresponding item, that means that by default, you add shortcut keys to them.
That forces user to make an higher customization work by remapping more shortcuts.
And problem also exists if you decide to create more menus and sub-menus, that means that you need to create new shortcuts for new menus and shortcuts for all sub-menus in order to give a quick access to restore a little bit of efficiency.

In 2.79, all keys are used. It is really difficult to change keymap. Because before assigning a key you often need to free it. You often ask yourself if it really worth it to remove shortcut from this operator to use it for this one.
And 2.79, although all keys are used, you can continue to call some operators by using menus or pressing buttons. Simply because they are not sufficient.

About addons that are messing up menus, I am not sure what is best solution.
Of course, user can’t memorize numeric shortcut that way.
But when you activate an addon, you probably uses it a lot. In that case, is it better to have it at the bottom of menu ?
It is probably a user preference depending on the way you want to access addon submenu (shortcut or click).