What you’re (implicitly) asking here sounds tricky to get right. If Blender operated on things the user cannot see, it could easily be a recipe for disaster (like driving while blindfolded).
greetings, Kologe
Why? Every 3D Software works now with selection of objects in outliner. I do that all time, in Unreal. I go to my branch, select objects, delete them. I can move them to build hierarchies, I can group them, I can move them on layers etc.
In Blender Outliner is limited.
For example, if you select all linked objects, you can’t do that in Outliner, only in Viewport, leaving out all hidden. The more complex the scene get, the more complicate it gets.
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It certainly does …for everyone who does not know how to use Blender and is not prepared to learn anything new. These new features bring more flexibility and make it possible to do things that were not possible before.
Node tools will work from Edit mode. Whatever your workflow, you can make whatever you need in 4.1 and add it to your quick favourites menu or assign a hotkey for it. Smooth shading is actually attached to geometry and will be the same for shared data and you have shade smooth/flat operators in edit mode. It’s also easy to write Python scripts, that do it for you in whatever situation you can imagine, and even if you don’t script with Python, you can always ask for help in various communities like here or Blender Stack Exchange. There is absolutely no problem here that cannot be solved. This whole drama is for nothing at all and reality is that Blender is getting way more powerful and easy to use.
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I was noticing that as well, with opening scenes from 3.6; haven’t determined if it’s a problem for me yet.
As to realizing instances in geo nodes - sometimes not an option, if you need the output to actually remain an instance for other reasons.
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Yes, I agree, if such a way of interaction was limited to the outliner, it would be great.
Having an auto smooth modifier is very convenient to use in geometry nodes (I’ve been waiting for it actually), but having it only in a modifier is a problem. I don’t know a thing about coding, but why does it have to be one or the other and not both?
I use instances a lot and a lot of the instances have auto smooth and having it in a modifier negates the performance of the instances especially in the viewport.
There’s the new shade smooth by angle option when right clicking but then you’d have to press it every time you change the mesh.
Here’s a quick comparison test I did with 3.6.4(left) and 4.1(right)
I thought maybe they improve the performance of instances that have the same modifiers, but maybe not.
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Once they have modifiers, they’re not instances anymore, they’re real mesh. That’s the real problem. If they want to properly introduce this system, they have to make it so that unless modifier generates new geometry, it shouldn’t be making instances real.
What you’re showing here is a stuff that can straight-up break softwares. @HooglyBoogly is there a way around this issue that we don’t know?
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Exactly, the best and fastest workaround (in my opinion) for 4.1 is the shade smooth by angle option, but you have to do it every time you change the mesh.
They shouldn’t take away something that works before giving it a proper replacement.
Though this is still in alpha, and there might be fixes and performance boost, maybe even instances that can have modifiers when it releases.
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I’m not even sure when would you ever need to shade by angle but only for current mesh? And not have it updated automatically? Why is that even a feature? Is it because there is performance hit when there is a modifier? There is a lot of questions, this is something that needs feedback thread on Devtalk in my opinion and clear communication from devs.
Yup… If you have a complex modifier stack then both 3.6 and 4.1 will be equally slow… so, in both cases you would need to apply the modifiers to get the performance.
Or use a different instancing strategy (Try this and compare @Jaxx ):
(Here the cube has some bevel modifiers and smooth edge at the end… 3.6 would just have bevel modifiers and the results would be similar… At least there is a workaround as shown above.)
But in 3.6 I don’t need to have modifier to have auto smooth, and in 4.1 I do. That is a regression. And having to add and apply modifier every single time I decide to make changes in a mesh is terrible UX.
Surely unless that issue is addressed this has to be reverted. We’re also seeing performance loss according to some users, not to mention way to add modifier is worse now than in 3.6, and having to add modifier for something that you need that often, in new menu, is not good.
In latest admin meeting they said more user feedback threads is needed on devtalk. This is one of the cases, I hope they do it and fix all UX issues before 4.1 is released.
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There isn’t always an option for different strategies though.
For example if I want to instance an object that has auto smooth across a landscape with specific placements. Do I have to fiddle with geometry nodes for an hour to instance it so it would perform better? while I could Alt+D and be done with it in 15 minutes.
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This is not true… See my earlier responses. The Right Click menu doesn’t add modifiers, and you have the additional option to apply the modifier (if you choose to use it) on your “master” instance.
The heading to this thread is fake news.
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No… for those use-cases the Right-Click option is sufficient since it is an instance and the mesh-data will be the same everywhere… no Geometry Nodes modifier required.
I don’t want to apply the modifier, why don’t you get that part? I want it to update automatically on all instances, like in 3.6. I don’t want regression, no apply modifiers, no workarounds.
Are you saying that auto smooth can update automatically when I change mesh without the modifier?
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But when you edit the mesh you have to shade smooth with angle again and again when previously it would be done automatically. Sounds like a very small problem, but it still bugs me.
Again, why can’t we have both instead of one or the other?
Maybe I’m just overthinking it a little bit 
That’s not a small problem and every single blender developer will agree on that. Having to constantly remember to do something that was done automatically in earlier version is a regression. I don’t want to ever press F12, wait for an hour and realize oh at last minute I updated my model and now entire animation is ruined because I forgot to apply auto smooth manually, and have to rerender.
No way Blender devs will allow this to land in stable release without changing UX on instances. I don’t believe that.
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@Jaxx - You always have the option to instance a collection:
In which case you can have the best of both worlds.
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You are right, it should get easier not worse. In 4.1 you will need the modifier, no way around it.
I remember using the modifier in 3dsmax a lot too, but then it had a better instance support. If you had an object with 100 instance somewhere hidden in groups in the scene. Take a desk in a archViz Scene with hundreds of room, you simple added the modifier once and it was on all instance. Easy. Dramatic lot of work in Blender to achieve the same freedom.
example: Search all object with linked data, unhide them. Select all, then select the one you had added the modifier in viewport (not possible in outliner) and copy the modifier to all. This also break the instancing and your performance. Just saying
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Man I admire your commitment to defend everything geometry nodes, but you realize that is not alternative right? I had something that was automatic in 4.0, and in 4.1 I will have to either just not use instances, or create a convoluted workaround with collection instances, hide the collection in the scene, and everytime I want to move one object around hide the instance, unhide the collection, move the object, hide the collection, and unhide the collection instance?
If it’s a modifier it shouldn’t be realizing instances. That is the end. Everything else is a regression.
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