Minotaur...

[Michael_W]

I started this a long time ago (about a year ago) in z-brush.
click for version1

Things happened, I got caught up in “paying jobs” and the sculpting got put aside.

I really liked how the face turned out, not shown off well here) but the body was the best I coud do, but felt too soft and vague… I was hung up between stylisation and realism and falling a bit flat…

Whilst doing the “blending life2” competition I imported it into blender to test out the new sculpt mode optimisations in 2.5

I got to this:

Essentially I shrinkwrapped a new retopo based multires cage around an obj with around 1.5 million polygons. I did this in 2.49, applied the shrink wrap and then loaded in 2.5 so it is auto converted to teh new multires… then using the clay brush with a variety of textures (so it works kindof like “clay”, “rake” and “claytubes” in z-brush I started detailing.

The symmetry diverged like crazy, so ultimately I only worked on half the mesh… I continued with the sculpt…

After much experimentation I gave in and decided the “oldschool” way was best:

I ended up uv-unwrapping the base cage in such a way that when mirrored the uvs will mirror nicely on “u” and baked a displacement map (back in 2.49 because 2.5 baking is a little buggy…)

then I added multires to the base cage and a displacement modifier using my newly baked displacement map.

As a side note, because I’m relying on displacement to restore my sculpt ready for further sculpting i used a 4k map, multiresed as far as I dare in 2.49… (one more level just hung blender)… It’s a bit lossy, but I can live with that as there’s not really any super fine detail there yet…

Here is the result, ready for some more detailing!:

Hands and fore-arms especially need more work and I’d like to do some sculpts that really push blender (and myself of course)…

To be honest it’s taken so long faffing about to re-symm and I’m so disapointed that I’ve had to go the " oldschool and lossy" displacement map route (how i would have done approached it before getting caught in the “shiny” features) I thought I’d post it here to give me a spurt to actually finish this!

anyway, i’m pleased with the overall feel and already have some ideas for accesories, posing and clothing that should punch this up to a nice folio piece… he’s a little neutral as yet!

Hopefully posting here will help me get some momentum!

[edddy]

Hi,
very great job!
with a nose more beastly, it seems more minotaur, I think
bye

[Gustav_Goransson (Gustav Göransson)]

I think it’s a great start, but there are few things you could work on. I did some rough tweaking in photoshop. This is what I changed:

• Change the pose a bit (he seems a bit of balance)
• Made the neck a bit shorter
• lower the kneecaps so they’re in line with the joint.
• Some minor adjustment to the head + a couple of other things.

The anatomy, especially on the arms, seems a bit off, so you might what study pictures of bodybuilders/comics/whatever in order to make improvements.

Hope it helps

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[Michael_W]

Thanks edddy, so you’re suggesting more animal face?

Thanks for the paintover Gustav, for the kneecap thing I think you’re thinking too human…

look at any animal anatomy books for hind legs of quadrapeds… especially the horse or cow… check where the kneecap really is! You’d be surprised!

in the above cow picture, that hard angle change on the thigh above the udder is the knee cap…

with the horse

you can see the bulge of the kneecap right next to his penis… again, much higher than where the actual joint flexes… if you compare these with skeleton pictures you’ll see that 's where the patella is…

the arms are done with refs from bodybuilders, but the fore arms are horribly mangled. If your issue is with the upper arms could you be more specific?

[Gustav_Goransson (Gustav Göransson)]

Well, I guess it comes down to what kind of joint you want. If you take a look at different refrences you can find both variants. If you prefer the “cow-version” you might to reshape that calf muscle (or whatever it’s called on cows) a bit since it’s placed a bit differently, as you can see on the references you posted.

[Curley]

The 2nd image looks like the face of the evil guy in Fable 2

[Jimtuv]

I agree Micheal you are right to keep the lower body animal like, not human. It would ruin the whole half man half animal aspect that makes the minotaur interesting. Awesome so far. This is going to be killer when you get the textures, accessories, posing and clothing done. I have always wanted to do a sculpt of a creature, but my machine wont handle all the geometry. 3 million is my limit.

[Jeepster]

holy crap dude O_O this is amazing
do you use reference images for anatomy or do you have it memorized?
i wanna hear all about your workflow

i think the end of the tail needs some attention, but it looks like you just didn’t get to it yet.
most bovines use their tail as more of a fly swatter which is why it has mostly hair at the end - maybe you could give the tail some hair strands with a rake brush or somethin (not sure if that’d look cool though, just an idea)

[Michael_W]

Gustav,maybe!

Curley, never played it, post a screenshot for a laugh!

Jimtuv, whilst this figure is nearly 7 million he’s rendering at around 1.5 million in what you see…

if your computer deals with 3 million then just do a design with several parts! hide the joins with accesories! (or with cunning UV layout bake to a displacement map and make seamless at the end in an editing package…

Jeepster, when I draw i usually have my anatomy memorised as i keep things loose-ish (see thread here) but when I sculpt I usually try and get as much reference as I can, often using several pictures for different parts…

but then again, i wanted to exagerate some things and diminish others to get interesting proportions…

you’ll see on my first take (only linked to) in the first post that initially the arms and shoulders were much bigger… I much prefer it right now with the “big wedge” or taper from massive shoulders down to small hands…

As for the tail, I intend to use particle hair on the final so am un-concerned ( yet…)

for workflow, I like to work in 2d to get a feeling, a “gesture”… something to aim for…

gather reference for how to flesh out the design (and anatomy etc)
do a quick base cage that I’m not fighting when sculpting…
I almost exclusively use the “clay” brush with a couple of masks which is a bit of a fight in itself, juggling size/strength constantly whilst i work (and when zooming in and out in the view…)

then (problematically) I stop often, render, sketch over, sit and stare wondering which way I’m going to go next!.. if I thought less and just got on with it I’m sure it’d get further quicker…

I’m loving the new solidify modifier for creating clothes and accessories…so am looking forward to doing that!

as for the sculpt I’m still trying to work out the “best” balance in a base cage… I’m trying to get something simple with an even density that can also be posed early… I’m tempted to do two… one for sculpting from, one that can be rigged quickly to bake to…(using shrinkwrap and surface snapping)

On the above model I’ll probably decide on a pose soon and finish the sculpt for that pose… (i do more stills than animation, and there’s a lot of overhead for an animation model that is un-needed if you just want a still…

I have a really big creature on the go as well, and another exaggerated proportions thing in the works too… will post here too when I focus on them more…

Perhaps i should only post again in this thread when I have something to show!

[tmcthree]

Very nice as usual.
Torso is particularly good. The only thing I’m not that keen on is the size of the legs. I realize you are making it anatomically accurate but he looks top heavy. The legs don’t seem as exaggerated as the upper body. They don’t look like they could support the weight. On an actual bull those legs only have to support half the weight of a normal (non-musclified) bull.

Out of interest, how many times is your model subdivided?

[Michael_W]

#Thanks TMCthree,

the top heaviness is perhaps just my sense of humour…
here’s another design I’m working on: see?

(for a big bloke he’s light on his feet)

the model in the render is multires 5, (around 1.5 million polys) I work on it at multires 6 (around 6.75 million polys)… the clay brush just seems to be better and less quirky at the higher counts…

on my laptop I can just about cope, but my desktop is really fluid at that top level…

[michalis]

If this gonna be Theseus then get ready for another nude. Helmet yes, weapons too, but nude. he he A dark place (labyrinth), a great scene is coming Michael W.
Its an impressing sculpt here, ‘feet’ need some work maybe. Details are fine for me.:yes:
Nose? OK its up to you.

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[Keith_M]

sweet model dude, maybe you could try the tusks a bit less smooth. rough them up a little with some bump. Chip a piece off the end of one. And be sure the transition between the ‘horn’ and the skull is smooth and the skin sort of adapts to the hold which the horn makes. Maybe give him an earing just to make him look slightly more ferocious. I think some well placed hair could add too. Pony tail sprouting from a bald head? Some tattoos on/near his face?

[Michael_W]

Thanks dude!

Earing maybe, but not through the lobe I guess… maybe a double…

The horns aren’t really started, just a base shape… and i haven’t really communicated the hair plan yet, but I think It’ll make sense in the end!

i always think tats near the neck/face are so early 90s! probably all the “tribal” tatoos that started appearing then, George Clooney 's tat in “From Dusk 'Til Dawn”, the red hot chill peppers breaking really big… that was all nearly 20 years ago… Hmm, feeling old now…shuffles…

[Keith_M]

Ornaments ilke earings, tattoos and such will define your character, immensly. If he’s a slave to higher master (the minotaur in the Lion Witch and the Wardrobe) you want him to have earings and some sort of symbol to point to a higher master. But if he’s a loner, he’s customized his own warfare garb. I personally don’t think his face looks scary enough, how about swelling one eye slightly larger and making the other be a sort of lazy/dead eye. That’ll throw some scar into you’re audience. Maybe he had a wound that never healed properly, that screams “I’m a tough guy, I can put up with pain” (Orcs in Lord of the Rings are like this). His weapons also will play a large part, if it were my project I wouldn’t give him any sort of sophisticated looking swords. He’s a brute, animal, he’s the guy who would ductape a machete to his shotgun. Of course…in the context of medevil weapons :). Best of luck.

[edddy]

I think if you just touch the nose, to make it more animal, with out change the entire face, it look less like a big faun
bye

[aasm271jr]

great sculpt sir

[Namssil]

No non steoroid taking organism has got that much muscle mass. With that much muscles, he would have a hard time moving. But it’s a great sculpt! Just very unrealistic anatomy.

[Michael_W]

@Namssil

No non steoroid taking organism has got that much muscle mass. With that much muscles, he would have a hard time moving. But it’s a great sculpt! Just very unrealistic anatomy.

Of course the legs and horns are completely realistic!, just the muscle mass that pushes this over! :rolleyes:

@eddy, a big faun, hadn’t thought of that, but you’re so right!

maybe it’s Bacchus’ minder!

aasm# Thanks dude.

[Michael_W]

… or maybe he’s just prime kobe beef