The Blender Integration Effort

(acasto) #1

Hey all, I have listened to lots of advice and suggestions on the Blender Package idea. I’m going to setup the site tonight hopefully and start a forum for project organiztion. The site will be located here as soon as I get it uploaded.
(What’s on their now is my company that went out of business)

I am calling it the ‘Blender Integration Effort’ because of the main goal : to get Blender better integrated into the market by supplying programs, documentation, tutorials, scripts, plugins, etc…

I have a copy of Maya Complete and some others that I will study to see what it is these other have exactly and that we could use. (If anyone has any suggestions please post them)

I’m hoping that for every industry application that NaN has on it’s sight (architecture, marketing, web desing, etc… ) that we can get examples and docs to back it up. So that industry professianl might feel a little better about it. (industry people always like the ‘in’ thing, like Cisco, it’s just the thing to have).
My end hope is that like like Kibs goal for elysiun, people will see what Blender is capable of, then supply the info and tools to get there.

The way I see it, the more acceptance and sales for Ton, the more toys and late nights of blendering for us… :smiley:

(acasto) #2

The site will be down for a little tonight and tommorow (may 4) while I do some server maitenance and future proofing. Hopefully once I get it back up we should have a good place for the BIE project to develop. :wink:

(IamInnocent) #3

Wow, that’s an ambitious project ! If it ever flies you’ll get extremely long wish lists telling you what Blender lacks to become a part of any industry. I do massing studies in Blender, like this one, , something I can afford only because I’m the one that will build the prototype and yet, I need a dose of Blender fanatism to endure. Beyond presentation to potential clients, Blender is useless as soon as you need to communicate plans, CNC files … I could go on so much.
Somewhere, someone forgot that a 10K dollars soft that makes you money is cheaper than any free one that brings no cash home. Factor in that I really love Blender to the point of using little else and you’ll get an idea of what to expect in the real, common world.
But I will help you as much as I can with it…

(acasto) #4

That is exactly what I think the problem is. Blender has locked it self in a room of it’s own. We need to try to open the door so that it may join the rest of the crowd through interoperability and so forth.

Blender’s ability to open individual parts of a file has some good potential for project management. This is some of the aspects we are hoping to look at to see if there is an alternative solution until other options present themselves.

(kos) #5

why don’t we advertise something in the leading 3d sites about our cool works made in blender. :slight_smile: .we really need to put some best art-works of blender in that gallery.we should think over this idea.anybody interested?

(LaWMan) #6

jeanamontreal wrote:
Somewhere, someone forgot that a 10K dollars soft that makes you money is cheaper than any free one that brings no cash home

That is a lot of BS!!! It is like saying that you cannot paint a painting and sell it just because you used a sponge and some of your own blood.

If you cannot get paid for the work you do in blender it’s you who is the problem. Just look at the TV commercials here in South Australia, they’re crap!!! Some of them made in expensive softs. And you can create better things with blender.

You must always see the opportunities, there will always be ways to put things down, but if we work for progress and believe in the opportunities, we enable the possibility of growth, - if not we kill that opportunity.


Let’s set the goal that Blender will be the animation package in all kids lunchpacks in the year 2010. :smiley:

(acasto) #7

lol…about the local commercials. I know even some commericals here in the US suck. The local ones are the worst, they look like they wore done with a 15year old video camera and basic :smiley:

That’s is one thing I would like to setup someday, is a freelance video/graphics business. Mainly just so I don’t have to see some of those commericals…

(Rob) #8

Blender is great, brilliant, fantastic, etc, BUT ‘so what’. That does not nessesarily get you very far. A lot of other business stuff has to be got right too. Is the Maya, et al, market where Blender is at? Probably not (OK so I have not used those and I am not in the 3D business, so I am happy to be wrong on anyeverything). Blender is so cool it has to make it? … Microsoft is not successful because it works…

Maya are right in saying that 3D is moving to ‘new’ areas. Corporate stuff, such as safty training videos, adding new flash to presentations, there is big bucks here.

There must be a market for Blender amonst all those professional workers looking for something to do on there mega PC’s of an evening at home?

Good luck

(acasto) #9

If they’re using other programs at work, then this is why they probably wouldn’t want blender at home:
1.) interoperatability - (lack of) between work and home programs
2.) availability - they probably get a heck of a discount on the others

This is why Blender must be accepted in the workplace also, not just the home for hobbyists.

(Rob) #10

I don’t want to belittle Blender by saying it is just for hobbists. I am saying that there is a potential market among people who do not get to use such software at work (ie do some other job), and would be able to get into it as a ‘hobby’ at home, if only they new about it. Yes Blender is more than this too.

(acasto) #11

One thing I think that we should focus on, is that when it comes to marketing a rather unknown/new product, it is probably best to focus on the products postives rather than the competitions negatives. This way we can help it to build an image of it’s own. Show that it can stand on it’s own feet (how ever many that might be) in the market. Also, since the human thought process when it comes to making a decision is throwing out the ones you don’t want, then building a logical ‘if, then, else’ table on the pluses and minuses of the exsisting choices. Then continuing to throw out choices until their pick remains. So it would be best for now if Blender wasn’t compared to other like 3DSM or Maya, but instead marketed as it’s self. That way people won’t draw any conclusions on the parts that are lacking.

just an idea, let me know what you think :smiley:

(acasto) #12

Finally the server is back to life, it was sad after 110 days of continuous uptime to reboot her. Oh well, after 21 hours of staring at apache modules and postgres code, it actually works. I still have to set up some things like PHP4 tommorow, but that shouldn’t be bad.

What I need to know now is suggestions on site usability, internationalization features, etc…

So let me know if anyone has any ideas.

Thanks alot,
adam :o

(LaWMan) #13

I am planning to translate some of the most helpful tutorials into norwegian. This would be of great help for Norwegian, Swedish, Danish and some Finnish youngsters out there.
Just considering which format etc would be most beneficial for all users, any ideas?

And Acasto i agree with you in the marketing idea of blender, it amazes me that NaN were not able to market it better. I actually discovered Blender by an “accident” 1 1/2 years ago (the best accident I’ve had in my life I should say).

I believe in the proper marketing to young people especially, since they are the future of tomorrow. Blender should emphasize it’s recreational capabilities through being a great medium for “easy” artistic expression.

(haunt_house) #14

I agree with acasto

Focussing on negatives is not the best way of advertising. Blender has serious advantages that can stand for its own. The interface (with maybe some refinements) cannot be beaten by any other windows-Application I know (I don´t know many 3d programs, but I know Photoshop, Quark Xpress, Flash, Director, Freehand…) no chance.

There is really impressive stuff possible in blender, only I haven´t seen it yet (OK, the fur in Dinosaur or Monsters inc. is a real problem yet). That´s why I suggested this Workgroups. Blender can get real credits, if the knowledge is deep enough. I have seen good lighting, but the meshes were too simple. I have seen good modelling and texturing, but the movements were bad. I have seen good animation (greetings to lyubomir) and so on…

I don´t bitch about other peoples work (I don´t care if it sounds that way, I don´t). I want to say that Blender will be measured by two and a half things:

Quality of the output
Time that was necessary to get it
the Prize

So one part of the best way of advertising is best possible output. I am certainly not advanced enough to create that all by myself. But I´d really like to see the guys from NaN where they belong. If anyone likes to do some incredible brainbreaking stuff with me, he is invited to join.

So I offer to throw my talents in for NaN

anyone else?


(acasto) #15

I’ m in of course haunt_house, I don’t start my new job till next month, so I have a month to do whatever…

One thing I would like to do is find ways to develope professianl quality methods for Blender. Alot of times it’s not necesarrily the program alone, but by the methods in which all the objects are used (programs, plugins, renderers, etc…) Have you ever seen the little ‘how they did it’ part on the Shrek DVD ? It is really neat, we should definitely put some concentration into animation. I would like to develope abetter system for muscle deformations and such.

Also, we should start looking more into external renderers, shaders, and plugins. Even the professinal packages for movies use externeal renderes (most use pixar rendeman). For instance in Shrek, donkeys fur and the grass were put on during render time with a shader. So this way you develope something really good at modeling, then something really good at rendering and shading, then something really good for postprocessing.

I am currently studying how to write shaders for BMRT with the renderman interface. Also that fact that most of these extra programs is open source or linux based is great. For Shrek, only 12% of the software was off the shelf, the rest was custom designed. ( I heard it was Linux) There is a book I need to get here soon on 3D math, so that we can write better python scripts (for example to translate axis). Well, I better get to work… :smiley:

(haunt_house) #16

Seems like we have something in common. I think the weakest (and strongest) point of blender is its complexity. The possible interactions and therefore solutions are astounding. And with python, nearly anything is possible. Maybe not on my machine but who cares.

I haven´t seen much of Shrek, but I have seen “the phantom menace” DVD where they have a nice (yet not perfect) waterfall tutorial. My fingertips tickle without pausing.

Animation is definitely my main interest. And the only way of getting muscle deformation done real properly in blender is using python (there are some ideas in my head). Would be a hell to render on my AMD300. But modelling the puppet is one thing, moving it is another. And in my opinion the most challenging task.

The funny thing about the software is that the other 88 percent now lay on the shelf just to become the new twelve percent.

If I only had the energy to do some python stuff. Is there a PDF about the basics on the net? I need it on paper.

By the way, I´d also like to learn Java, and my japanese must get a bit better and I draw not often enough… I certainly must stop wasting time.


(Rob) #17

Yes you have to focus on the products positives, there is a lot to focus on! I don’t think Blender should be compared with Maya,Max etc, however part of the market of those products is a good target.

Blender does not need changing it needs marketing.

(acasto) #18

I just noticed something that is very interesting, I was thinking about the blender plugin and how big it is and how many people don’t have fast connections. But then I thought that a one time download wouldn’t be that bad for what’s its worth. But then I was just at the new Netscape 6.2 page and stumbled upon the plugin downloads and I saw that there was a 3D animation plugin page. I was surprised to see that there is a ‘LOT’ of 3D or animation plugins out there.

This is where some serious marketing would come in. I know Blender has potential for architectural walkthroughs, but has anyone looked into Adobe Atmosphere? It is going to be awesome when it’s out of beta for 3D walkthoughs. Check it out when you get a chance at (I think).

Just a little market info :smiley:


(Socinian) #19

Business use
I’ve always felt that the best business use for 3D would be a new product that would be the equlivant of …

Visio gone 3D :o …just snap prebuilt objects together to create:

  1. a workflow diagram you can ride like a train
  2. a factory floor
  3. lines of corporate communication
  4. organization chart that comes alive with how projects flow trought it over time
    etc.User Interface
    For User Interface improvements I’d recommend that you read
    “The Humane Interface” by Jef Raskin
    It’s not perfect, but he shows to you what works. I have a summary here…
    Also “Don’t Make me Think” by Steve Krug indicates what the general public needs out of software.

I’ve always believed the best use of Blender would be to allow students to create their own education materials or educational games. Not for studying 3D but to create and express stories about what they’ve learned or wish to learn.