Tunnel of enlightment (abstract ahoy, i'd like to hear from you)

http://gallery.mudpuddle.co.nz/view_photo.php?full=1&set_albumName=kansas15&id=0183_G

The newest image in my series of abstract images.

Like all the rest, made in 2.42 Blender Internal renderer.

I promised myself I wouldn’t be overly critical of other peoples work, but isn’t this just another of a long line of artworks of yours that really requires no skill whatsoever?

I mean I could knock up ten or so pieces like this a day, and use them to bombard this forum, but I don’t. Neither should you.

So much for not being overly critical. Sorry.

Well, [email protected] may have been a bit harsh. But I have to agree with him.

Sorry dude.

BgDM

Depends on how you look at it, but you do realize some of these (the abstract images) do require some know how when you do these.

First you have to think of an idea, I thought a tunnel might be interesting so I chose that.

Then you have to figure out the style of the mesh, if you want it random then what tools will be needed to make it look good, this is a little more then just fractel subdivide and shrink flatten many people use.

Then you have to pick your materials. I knew it would look drab under the default material, I thought a ramp shader that was reflective would do the trick.

Then comes the strategic placing of lights in the scene, lighting can really improve an image like this. I tried avoiding too many white spots and took a few tries before I liked the lighting.

Also note this is an abstract image, one may be mistaken to think that it requires no skill to make it look good with some evidence of structure (like the tunnel shape.)

If you don’t like abstract images like this, that’s fine, no one has in his head the same definition of what is art but some people may still call it art. Look at those paintings in some art museums that have those black lines with bright colored fills, sure you could do it in any paint program today but people call it art.

So it’s your call on wether I am thought as a decent artist or an extremely large flop.

Skill is not indicative of art these days… Skill is what craftsmen are valued for… Art - its about world, ideas, perception and so on…

You still need some skill to produce good art, a one may mesh together many different styles in an awkward way and may not be percieved by the majority. In renders, if you had an odd mix and placement of cartoony objects in a photorealistic render it may not turn out so good. But what I posted, it shows a consistant idea and style as I believe.

Believe me, if works like this aren’t art, then many thousand dollar paintings and works should not be in world renouned art museums.

alright, understandable. but now how about moving on to something more complex? youve done all this work, so i imagine youve learned a few things and gained some experience, so how about trying something a bit more technically difficult to test your skills?

and those “paintings in some art museums that have those black lines with bright colored fills” look/are technically really simple, but they are the result of a long and complicated conceptual and philosophical process that goes way beyond the physical manifestation that you see. to everything there is a reason, there is a definite reason for why a certain painting or artist makes such an impact despite seemingly childish technical results. if you do some research and background work on modern abstract art, you will see that there is a rhyme and reason to everything that gets done. there is method to the madness that cant be duplicated by simple imitation of a piece, or by the idea that anything that doesnt correspond to how we traditionally visually perceive the world is immediately abstract art.

if you could explain the way in which you came about to this end result, not from a technical standpoint but the conceptual, then it could have some merit.

all in all, i dont mean to be too critical, but youve got to understand what it means to make ‘abstract art’.

visually its quite nice, though. but again, go beyond what youve been doing now, take the next step, and im sure people here wont get annoyed as much. anyways, i commend you for your tenacity and dedication to this medium. keep it up.

I do and have done art about many subjects, from bars of soap to treehouses to comical images. After seeing that some people liked the abstract images when I started posting them, I decided, hey, maybe I should do more of them.

right, but whats your process? how do you go about abstracting a certain idea or concept? tunnel of enlightenment doesnt tell me much about what i see in that picture. bars of soap and treehouses are good technical exercises but you are still representing what you see through eyesight in a very literal way. abstract art is a completely different way of conceiving things, of putting something intangible into a physical medium where it can be seen, touched, heard, etc.

again, im sort of being a picky bitch, but i think you should understand the basis of abstract art if youre serious about getting into that. my two cents.

I think of an idea and when i’m done I choose a name I see fit. My ideas well, they just pop in my head out of nowhere often times when i’m currently doing a previous idea or before I do another piece.

My definition of Abstract would be. “A piece of art that gives no literal meaning, but gives some flexibility in allowing the viewer to interpret it in his or her own way”

So this would be considered abstract as the form of the art is not entirely concrete. And others like My candle image is not because it displays an actual image that has a concrete intepretation.

just for the record, I have been following your…series…and so far I havent seen anything I didn’t like. I would however recomend that yourestrict all your abstract art to one thred.

but once again: I really like your work and I don’t recomend you stop just because two people are having a bad day.

not being defensive or nothing, if CornDog was at all making an allusion to my annoying nitpicking, i dont hate what CyborgDragon is doing, its quite nice, just i think itd be a good opportunity to expand now that hes got this amount of work done. such productivity is admirable in fact. just my thoughts.

oh sorry, I wasn’t talking about you, StompinTom
I was refering to [email protected] and BgDM

no worries

I could tell you mean BgDm and Madcow, They seem to have exhibited a very literal interpretation of art. That they think art requires something taken with a lot of skill and time and has to be within certain bounds to be even called decent art. I have a bit looser definition of art, that art can be almost anything that can be made, as long as the flow and the idea come smoothly.

Far out Brussels!! The image isnt so bad. Yer, so Cyborg should maybe decrease quantity for quality, but dont jump down his throat for it!

This image is quite good too! It makes me think of being high in the trees looking at the forest floor. Quite dynamic imho.

This is a great forums with a lot of respect floating round, so lets not destroy it by abusing the lesser skilled members.

Someone mentioned restricting it to one thread - good idea. That said, DONT stop churning out work. Practice makes you bored. I mean makes perfect :slight_smile:

Regards,
Greenlig

Now, now. I don’t have a literal interpretation of art. I totally understand what you are doing and respect the fact that you continue to use Blender to acheive the visions and ideas that you have. Look at RobertT’s abstract renders. I comment on those in a positive way all the time. But he is also trying to generate specific forms and get across a specific idea or feeling through his abstract works.

However, with that being said, I have also been following your progress with Blender since the old Kansas days through to now and I have seen no improvement or desire to push your modelling or rendering skills at all. You tend to slap a few poly’s around, add some reflective materials and hit the render button.

Again, I mean no direspect, but to not improve at all in the timeframe that you have been using Blender, I can not sit back and say “wow! nice reflective/glassy block of somehting!”

BgDM

and, I totally agree with BgDM.

It’s not that this image totally suck. but, unlike other abstract stuff I,ve seen…I see no particular interest or message in this one. It might be “OPEN” to interpretation…but there is no interpretation to be made out of this one.

Anyway I won’t repeat what BgDM and others have already explained…I just agree that I see no desire from you to push your technical skills so you can later, hopefully, apply those skills to your abstract art…like Robert is doing (since you seems to like his work are are inspired by him)

I could tell you mean BgDm and Madcow, They seem to have exhibited a very literal interpretation of art. That they think art requires something taken with a lot of skill and time and has to be within certain bounds to be even called decent art.

You’ve hit the nail on the head. I don’t think I will ever regard work like this as art, in any sense of the word. For me true art requires artisanship, suffering and time…not something you can knock out in 20 minutes.

Case in point, when I went to the tate modern, there is a work there from Piero Manzoni called ‘shit in a can’ that was quite literally that. Shit in a can. Anyone who buys into the theory that this guy was some conceptual genius or that he was making some postmodern ironic statement really need to have their heads looked at. I am also accutely aware that my opinion is exactly as valid or as invalid as everyone elses, at least when it comes to art. I know how subjective it is.

There is one other thing that made me post in this thread Cyborg Dragon, and that’s the fact that I spent about 20 minutes looking through your gallery, and I saw tons of images that had the potential to be really very good had you spent a little more time and effort working on them. Here are some of them:

http://gallery.mudpuddle.co.nz/view_photo.php?set_albumName=kansas15&id=0158_G
http://gallery.mudpuddle.co.nz/view_photo.php?set_albumName=kansas15&id=0089_G
http://gallery.mudpuddle.co.nz/view_photo.php?set_albumName=kansas15&id=0019_G
http://gallery.mudpuddle.co.nz/view_photo.php?set_albumName=kansas15&id=0010_G

So these images tell me you have an eye for composition and subject matter, but are too lazy to actually complete these works.

And I had a fantastic day yesterday :wink: That was not the reason I said what I said.

I just saw in the city paper today of someone who just painted a canvas green and red and called it a finished work of art, now I see how I can how it can be art, he didn’t use colors that are hard to look at.

Now I can see that the more prominent members here imply that i’m just a failure as an artist or am too lazy to make any piece of work really good. Ecks has said back in the old days that I had no future as an artist, maybe he was right.:frowning: