A new home for the BGE!

The new home: We want to give the BGE a new home. In the future, the BGE will be further developed under the name “Game Engine Vision” (copyright 2018 WIPN), i.e. “GEnV”, as a new core technology for VR and realtime applications. The new house should be reliable, transparent, fair and future-oriented. For this purpose we will create a new association, the Game Engine Virtual Reality Association (copyright 2018 WIPN). The association will work according to German law and apply for the non-profit. This ensures that everything is transparent and under the control and voice of the members. A worldwide well-known example of this model is the ADAC (German Car Club). This is our role model. A minimum of 500 members are required for the foundation of the Association. Only then can we establish the association in a serious, reliable and stable manner. So let us come together now!

The benefit: Every member of the association has the right to participate in the economic development of the Association and the technological development in the future. Only if we make sure that the work of the numerous developers in the world of new ideas, software, projects, forums, tutorials, book authors and many others can benefit more from the development of the work is a reliable development of the technology possible. But we can only do that together. I’m convinced of that.

This is a worldwide call to those who have used the BGE and want to continue using it:
Who is going to give the BGE a new home and lead them into a new future?

Details:
Background: Blender has come in the years. In these years, the concept of Blender has become obsolete. From the point of view of Blender, therefore, ballast had to be thrown off, i.e. the BGE. But exactly with this decision, Blender stands on his head and no longer on his feet. The market is clearly in the direction of virtual reality. Especially when “things” are becoming more and more connected, VR is gaining in importance. That is why we needthe BGE and a consistent further development. To this end, we want to go into the future together with a new concept, the World Community Software (WCS). We want to develop this new concept in the new association, which is based on the open source concept.

The new concept: Open software originated from a radical thought, namely that information is free and should be available to everyone. Blender is open source. However, the concept does not work properly, because it also creates major problems and in the end the community has to deal with these problems. We clearly see these problems, for example, that the BGE has now been deleted. We no longer want us, the community, to carry out the problems in the years-old concept and in the end many self-employed and also companies have to bear the costs, because their projects, developments and know-how is worth nothing more. In principle, the principle of freely accessible software should be maintained, but the concept must be made future-proof.

To this end, a new association is established, which is requested as a charitable. It is therefore subject to strong control by the members and the Tax Office. We can only develop the BGE future-proof if we take money into it. We will therefore be looking after sponsors. But in order to get a fair trial and not create a one-way street where only one side benefits and others do it, there are at the beginning two different levels of membership. The normal memberand the company member. They differ in their contributions, which are necessary under the law of the Association. The normal member pays 10 euros per month and a company member 100 euros per month, revolving for one year. Of these contributions, basic financing for the development of the software is to be ensured reliably and in the long term.

The goal is that together with sponsors we are able to pay a core team of up to 10 developers for more than one year according to usual salaries. Anyone who is a member of the community can also change the program or suggest new features. Proposals from the community will be examined by a panel. After the Panel has made a decision the proposal will be integrated into the core software within a few weeks. We want to be able to pay for this work in the future according to a transparent key. Because every development costs time, sweat and is usually a lot of work. This must be rewarded. After the founding of the Game Engine Virtual Reality Association, we want to develop and establish a model quickly.

We can only do this if everyone is now and under reliable conditions.We can bring together 500 members for the association, the BGE will go into a new future in which the focus is on the development of realtime applications.

Check marks: If you want to join the association, please send me an e-mail that he wants to join the new community and the new association. This declaration is binding and is valid for one year so that we can achieve a planning certainty.

The acceptance/registration period starts on 1. Main and runs until 1 June 2018. I will publish the number of members in a new thread every week under the name „GameEngine Vision“.

If we do not reach the number of members, the project expires and all membership declarations are automatically invalidated.

We have a chance, we take it and we do not gamble our possibilities.

E-Mail: [email protected]

PS: Many questions are still open. The work of the association is recorded when it can be founded. Anyone who wants to contribute now can send suggestions at any time. The procedure for establishing the association is, however, clearly specified in German law. According to these guidelines, we will take the first steps in a transparentand comprehensible manner (the association can be founded, so the reis enough joining, the statutes are created, the panel/board are named and the new house is presented to the public working capacity). One of the first and most important activities will be the opening of discussions on cooperation with other associations, companies and other possible partners from the VR market.

Peter

Now that you said BGE will be worked on with different name, it kinda reminds of that BGE Fork thing I’ve heard of…

dude who even are you?

we already have a fork,
we don’t need to spread anyone any thinner.

Hmm, so you grab bge and start all over, better grab ketsji then, Upbge has died, and the whole concept is transferred over to ketsji.
Build from that, contact their team, and join them to create something better, starting from the old bge is a waste of time.

Just my suggestion

Or why not keep BGE in the way it is and defend it by making new games with it?

Because current bge is falling way behind. the fork Upbge has done a great job fixing bugs and adding alot of new good and needed features. Now ketsji is taking over Upbge, so best way to create a better engine is by adjusting ketsji, or re-write the whole bge engine.

Don’t worry, I’ll be in contact with the respective branches in the near future. Let’s see what comes out. That you have a branch is good. But better is the clarity about the development and whether there is a stable team.

The same… The name is not the crucial thing. We will see which branch works best.

From my perspectives, for hobbies, that’s OK. But for professional applications, the risk is too high.

Just to clarify, Ketsji is taking over nothing…

UPBGE members were off the grid, so we didn’t know how to contribute on a project with no one around.

Hence the https://github.com/bge-community group, its just a place where anyone can contribute to the engine, because “Ketsji” doesn’t do anything, “Ketsji” is just the original name of the BGE, and we just want to make sure that when people want to contribute, their contribution should be accepted (given a little review).

“Don’t wait for changes, make the changes” kind of idea.

That’s for Ketsji and how I see things with it.

Let us work together!
My proposal does not preclude anyone. It is intended to help develop a perspective. That’s it. As long as we only talk about the surface, that is not happening at the moment, nothing will change. And we look longer at the current state, the smaller the chance of a change.

When you read the comments on all the platforms, you will see how much uncertainty is in the community. Let us end this uncertainty. I very much regret the status of UPBGE. That was another hope that has now burst.

And I’m so new (noob) in BGE, that I do not even dare to join a team - I do not want to be an unnecessary ballast.
And ahead there are still shaders, there seems to be a place for development …
I’ll make myself a game in the style of Doom 3© and Half Life 2©, maybe I’ll make money for myself … may be.

We need to collect a bunch of assholes, let them work for us. Do I understand correctly?

I’ve played with BGE some and honestly for the amount of work required to fix it, they may be far better off just writing one from scratch and doing away with those pesky copyright issues.

Why not contribute to Armory? It has deep Blender integration, is already light years ahead of where BGE left off, has the backing of seasoned industry pros, and isn’t bogged down by years of bad code cruft. It’s modern, it’s actively developed, and it’s built specifically for Blender.

1 Like

Hi,be very care with your fork gentlemen. In another thread, the potential benefactor hadn’t done a search on “BGE” and “VR” but, now he has done so and seen there are people working with VR, now returns with a proposal.

I’m a noob in programming but quite savvy elsewhere. You should be asking for Terms of Reference, Organisational Structures, Location of incorporation, Licensing of code, Assets and commercial/non commercial software builds (if GPL is out) etc.

Hope for the best and prepare for…

Ian

I don’t see the backing anywhere. Haxe is slow as fuck. Not sure about the “modern” and “active dev” of it. Let’s wait and see, maybe the 1.0 (released free the dev says) will be amazing and will make us forget BGE once and for all… but I doubt it.

upbge already has most of the tricks the big engines use, they just are not as developed.

if we have PBR[princiled shader + lightfield precompute tool) , Batched render calls (pbr means all scenery can easily batch) Physics LOD, and kdtree based lamp manager + forwared+ shading I think it would look really really nice and perform well.

any cases where logic is too slow, we need to teach the userbase how to extend the engine easily with C

I think the time of the many word is over. We have to act now.
Every vote in the vote now counts whether we really want the BGE together or not. Or whether it is just a word and will remain.
My proposal is on the table (see first entry in this thread).

That’s exactly what I see. But realizing that is hard and a long way, as we see. We now need to create an organisational framework in order to be able to develop technology long and stable.

In my view, I can only say that a central question must be answered for our own development of projects: is there a stable team for the development and development of an engine? That seems to me to be the central question. The team should also not be less than five programmers, as otherwise little influence on the team can completely prevent further development. The larger the developer team is, the more secure the future of the software. This is mainly due to the know-how transfer within larger groups. In the case of larger groups, more people know about the software than with a small group, whereby in small groups often a “saint” or “guru” decides everything (and if he has no desire anymore, the engine/software is dead). So the question of the team answers is the question of the quality of the software (documentation, compatibility, handling, etc.) and according to the functions that I can use. Only then should the Lizenfragen be clarified. Often the licensing questions can be clarified or individually adapted.

In the current situation with the BGE and UPBGE poses the question, I am ready to throw everything from Blender! So make a hard cut. I can only recommend, YES you should do that. I have now accompanied over 10 years of Blender, first private then professionally. Result: For small projects we make a hard cut in the professional field to Unity or Unreal. UPBGE is dead! BGE is dead! Blender is in an absolute development phase to 2.8 or 2. XYZ, whatever. The overall development at Blender shows only one thing, Blender is good for the private sector but NOT for the professional sector (see current development). This also applies to all other branches that continue on the BGE or Blender. Blender has not yet managed to rebuild the organization. Blender is as much in need of renovation as the software in its entire internal structure. To make it even more glaring, Blender is totally outdated. Software and organization belong together!

My conclusion for now and today: Blender is good for hobbies. BGE is dead. UPBGE is dead. The rest (Amory, Ketsji, etc.) is too uncertain (has the potential that you have to throw everything overboard again after some time). For small projects, Unreal or Unity is a real alternative, because they are also completely free, a way to individualize the licensing model, to have stable development teams (and enough team members), and to offer really modern functions (Multy device support, VR, etc.).

Bge is fine, GPL is fine.

There are bge games on steam and elsewhere.

Getting mixed reality working will help us look more relevant
Getting forward+ will help us have high frame rates
Getting PBr will make us look better for artists
Getting Moguri/lord loki armature skinning patch makes high detail actors possible.
Getting some acceration and export pipes will shore up the existing logic

but first, the BGMC 28 :smiley: