Blender 2.8 development thread

I always cringe when I hear the term “industry standard”…no such thing…standards are things that are maintained by one organization and used by all others…like OGL or Dolby etc…you get my point…

it’s not like autodesk created keyboard input…therefore there is no such thing…that and blender already had hot keys…some are cumbersome yes, but do not make blender maya…please god no. :smile:

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@MartinZ
I do not disagree that there was certainly a lot of work that went into making those pie menus. I just meant that they are very specific to one person’s preferences, not something that new users should be confronted with when they first encounter a new software. When you look at his first screenshot, you see a menu which incorporates object properties, display settings, modifier control, material settings, primitive creation and drawing tools into one. It’s like baking a chocolate, avocado, chicken, lemon curd, bacon and mayonnaise pie. Sure, it’d have everything but it may appeal only to someone with very specific taste.

I for example use your enhanced pie menu for object origin manipulation, and it’s the exact kind of thing pie menus are great for.

@pitiwazou
Yes, exactly, I understand it. That pie is mainly for your productivity or for users who are willing to give some time to learn it. I am certainly not saying it can not be useful. What I mean is that in vanilla Blender 2.8, it would be good to have more specifically categorized and simpler pie menus, so learning curve isn’t that hard for new users or existing 2.79 users migrating to 2.8. I consider Maya’s hotbox to be quite an overkill, and not a good example to take. :slight_smile:

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By the way, does anyone knows about what happened to bWidget? I was excited about the project, also by the CSS connection. And the UI from Pablo?

I agree. Maya’s menus are as if they started a good thing but then just left it unfinished. It’s not that easy to come up with a way to put all functions to pie menus so they can all become muscle memory, but I think if we are talking about pie menus, that’s the direction we should be going to. The best thing is muscle memory - let’s do more of that.

Don’t want to build on muscle memory nowadays… making artist a handicap when strategies, techniques change, projects differ too much

goes against ‘learn & unlearn’ fast or as needed, especially for generalists

I don’t really like nested pie menus.

If you don’t build on muscle memory then you are doomed to click everywhere and re-read every menu every time you trigger it. That will inherently make you unproductive compared to the other artists in the field, and likely the very first one to lose a job, since others are able to do the same work faster, and therefore cheaper. Being unproductive is by far a worse handicap.

I’d also argue that software built on top of paradigms for easy memorization in form of muscle memory is equally as easy, if not easier to learn.

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You don’t want to build on muscle memory.
I definitely want. That’s the way i roll. I played piano once and i was an avid gamer.
Muscle memory helps keeping me in the flow and it is much more comfortable for me to wrangle with shortcuts and stuff like that, than me aiming and clicking on stuff in an GUI.

I have no problems to learn and unlearn, keeps the whole affair interesting.

So if i work like that, there sure as hell are others who would argue your point.

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Lukas Tönne work for real time realistic Hair in viewport using GPU started even before Eevee project. The last thing I had read was that he would abandon the project due to lack of time. Do you know if Lukas resumed the project working together with Ton and 2.8 devs with the idea of making it Eevee compatible? Or is it that he is simply working on the old project in free time?

https://developer.blender.org/rBb11a1d5da26fa2906955e54254672b1af075d0dc

Could allow popup panel to stay visible.
Lets hope addons could use it too.

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Best news of the day! Really hoping this works with addons too.

Don’t you get better results (noise wise) due to importance sampling (not sure on this) ?

And while at it, would it be possible to give those (and the old) lights some sane texture coordinates (generated or uv) for applying image textures to them ? :slight_smile: (please)

The buildbot is running again! :slight_smile:

Why? You can learn that and then unlearn as well it’s not a life long deal that you will need to train for with budist monks for 15 years. Takes a month or so when you do it 8 hours a day every day. Plus if its pie menus then it’s visual as well, the training is completely effortless. I do not see disadvantages here. They are regular menus, BUT you can also access stuff way faster by just draging the mouse quickly in the same direction that you would if you were looking at the menu and moving it slowly anyway.

Unfortunately this does not work with blender’s pie menus… pies have to be spawned before the user can select any of its contents, while in Maya we can just, as in your example, drag a path that leads to the desired item without waiting for the pie to even appear. I requested this back when psy-fi was working on it but that did not make it in the todo-list. :frowning:

@burnin : it’s good for your brain ! Do it ! :smiley:

Beginners don’t want to remember things, they want them available directly.

Sugar & math are good for my brain - planning ahead, contemplation, meditation, good food and sleep.
At my age, kids who watch me do things, get easily scared of my abilities. Staying humble with smile on my face, explaining the relations, using associative memory helps much more than a pretrained setting (why brain gets lazy). Mostly needed in environments where problem solving is a major skill.

Beginners need to learn, experience stuff or they’ll fail. Perseverance, trust and respect take ages, decades to become real actions (not just words).

When Blender 2.8 is moved to master, will there still be a branch for what is now 2.79 in master?
Please, warn us in advance when this happens, so that we can download and keep the latest build of 2.79 in master generated by buildbot :slight_smile:

Multiwindow works really well now with todays build.

I have a question about the behavior in future.
Will it be possible to run eevee and cycles at the same time in the same viewport(window). At the moment, the viewport outside of renderborder is just grey.

I want eevee as viewport, cycles on top, but paused and render-border is minimized.

Now when i unpause cycles, max the render-border and dont have to wait until cycles loads textures an geo. This way, with a small script, pause and resume cycles takes just seconds.

cheers Daniel

Credit goes to: ronin19587

Well it works a bit differently than in Maya, but you just need to pause in the motion slightly. I think it can work well Blender. It doesn’t work by default, there are settings in user preferences.