OS X .4 is just as large as Vista, I am surprised no body called OSX ‘bloated’. In fact, it ships on a DVD a long time before Vista came into being.
The fact is that Vista Ultimate has tons of features unneeded for a home user, or even power users. I am hoping that Home Premium - which by the way is the minimum version you should go for if you want Vista - will take up less space and installs less services by default than Ultimate RC2.
On the other hand, MS is really trying to monopolize the market by integrating everything into its OS. gadgets, mail, chat, rss, encryption, media center(which is awsome in RC2 by the way:D), 3d chess games, performance benchmark… Some times it’s a good thing, I hate having to install 20+ other third party apps just to get my computer up and running.
However, I have a feeling someimes MS just doesn’t ‘get it’. That user control function is a joke. I can’t do ANYTHING without having to answer 20 popups. And why make the gadges take up precious screen space if you can easily show/hide them like in OSX or even Yahoo! Widget?
valarking, how are the menus in blender? the only (limited) time I tried blender under vista, blender menus were excruciatingly slow- something to do with the bling desktop effects maybe, but I don’t know if that was specific to a certain configuration, or a vista vs. blender problem- one fear is that if microsoft is running opengl “on top” of directX that it could mean an unfixable slowdown.
I think it’s running a stripped down version of the OpenGL implementation. After all, with DirectX being exclusive to windows, directx will have exclusive advantages over OpenGL.
This was true with XP as well, but I think it’s more obvious here because Vista chugs more resources.
Yeah, it’s just a misconception about what comprises an OS. As I said, the majority of the space in OS X comes from the bundled software and I presume it will be the same for Vista. Garageband alone takes up 3GB because of all the uncompressed loops it installs. The systems themselves should only be around 1.5-2GB.
I don’t like that way of thinking. Home users and Pro users should get the same tools and the OS should have a built-in way of changing appearance to suit each type of user. This means that both pro users and home users can use the same machine. Imagine the situation of a computer professional who also wants to let his wife use the machine (don’t mean that as sexist, just an example. The woman could equally be the computer pro).
I read somewhere they tried to cut down the number of popups in a recent release. If you have RC2, I guess they didn’t unless they were talking about RC3.
Marketing is indeed a horrible thing. It affects people of all persuasions of course. Mac users used to think 800MHz Macs were faster than 2GHz Pentiums - I was getting ready to switch during those dark times.
It’s quite funny to watch when you try and tell someone else what’s best for them and you know they’ve been blinded when they have that blank expression on their face like it’s going in one ear and out the other. My uncle used to have an old Mac (OS 8 or something) and he switched to a PC last year and OMG he got so ripped off with one of the worst deals I’ve seen.
But, whenever I say to him about the deal he got, he doesn’t want to hear it 'cos he assumes as a Mac user, I’m just bashing it for the sake of it (dunno where he got that idea :p). I mean he got like a 1.7GHz Celeron and it was over £900. Sure it came with all the crap of the day: TV tuner, two DVD drives, printer/scanner, camera so he was quite pleased but it had no Windows disc, an LCD with a dead pixel and all the spyware you could imagine on the restore disc. I’ve managed to get rid of all the problems after about 20 hours of cleaning the registry, startup items and running as many virus scanners but damn it is one piece of shit.
The trouble is that it will never change. Companies make money by convincing consumers their product is best so there’s no quick hurry to educate consumers that they may be better elsewhere. The internet goes some way to help but you get so many mixed reviews, it can make it worse. After reading a thread like this, people still wouldn’t know which system to go with.
People also forget that the majority of users need to do a given task and not use an OS for what it is. The OS is essentially transparent. This is becoming obvious to a lot of Mac users who now have to run Windows because Adobe CS runs like ass (not nice ass but ugly ass) under Rosetta. I still need OS X because I use Shake but now I also need Windows to run Adobe stuff.
Doesn’t turning Aero off fix the slowdown with Blender then? Surely there’s no way that Microsoft can get away with doing something permanent to slow down OpenGL. All developers will do is say they don’t support Vista.
There was a bit of controversy about 8 months ago when MS explicitly said that they wouldn’t support OpenGL as a counterpart to DX, but instead it would be layered on top of DX (resulting in huge slowdowns unless you switch off the Areo interface systemwide)… since then they’ve revoked that decision, but it is up to the Gfx card manufacturer to write the OpenGL driver. VK, have you installed the Gfx drivers from the (Nvidia) website, or are you using the MS ones?
Whatever the case may be, microsoft won’t be effected. As long as they hold windows, they can pretty much do whatever they want, and the devs will just have to adapt.
The fact that windows holds that 90% majority is enough to force the devs to develop under DirectX (If the app in question really needs hardware acceleration).
Actually, it’s a pretty smart move on microsoft’s part. Ruthless, but smart.
I don’t like that way of thinking. Home users and Pro users should get the same tools and the OS should have a built-in way of changing appearance to suit each type of user. This means that both pro users and home users can use the same machine. Imagine the situation of a computer professional who also wants to let his wife use the machine (don’t mean that as sexist, just an example. The woman could equally be the computer pro).
Even in Home Premium, ($199), there are enough ‘advanced’ features to keep power users happy.
I was Actually distinguishing between different versions of Vista. Rather than seeing Home as a stripped down version of Ultimate, view Ultimate as an enhanced version of HOME. I mean, how many user requires the functions available in Ultimate(which is $499, btw)? like IIS? PHP/CGI/ASP server and 64GB+ RAM support??
64 GB of RAM… Now that’s not the package the average Joe needs. I thought my 1,24 GB was quite good…
I suppose ethics and Microsoft are each on one end of the spectrum.
A monopoly is NEVER good. Not for the economy, not for the consumers, not for the development of the branch in which the company has a monopoly. It is only beneficial for the company itself.
IMHO, the only reason most people use Windows is because most software they need can only be run on Windows. And because most people use Windows, software developers will develop only for Windows. And we all know that’s a vicious cycle.
But I’m getting tired of bashing major corporations… Windows is not all bad, you know.
for people who are still worried, OpenGL is working fine under Vista! I have no problem running Blender 2.42 with Vista RC2 under an nVidia Geforce 6 graphic card. there are no drawing issues, no corrupted menus, no black screen. The only draw back is that game fps decreases by about 10%, not noticiable, but numbers don’t lie…
That’s probably because Vista supposedly implements DirectX 10 (exclusively), but it runs DirectX 9 as a layer (obviously involving some overhead).
I’m amazed to see hear number of people who are promising they’ll migrate to a non-Windows OS because Vista is “just too much”, without really bringing any functional innovation. Personally, I’ll try to remain on XP for as long as I can, and migrate when computer specs have evolved to the point where Vista no longer looks like a resource hog (I remember being outraged that Windows 95 needed 8MB RAM!)
BTW – that pretty WIMP interface? Keep in mind that it all comes from XEROX. Usability has not really evolved a lot after that, even if aesthetics have.
I agree. You have to admit. Everything in windows is way behind Linux, the only thing that windows excels in is it’s games. But that’s only because it’s used more, and if windows and Linux had the same owner count then I bet Linux would be further ahead.
Alot of people use Maya, does that make it better then blender?
Please review your own words which I will quote below, perhaps your description of me applies much more towards yourself as your reading comprehension is lacking.
“Q: 6- how does your computer hardware rank on the meter thing that says how well it should run Vista”
Yes, you feel I am the moron who is trying to interpret your “elastic” Vista meter. A rating of 2.4 is bleow medium and naturally 5.6 - 6 is “Way Off The Scale”. Again, is this a scale of 1 to 5 or 1 to 10??
Clearly you fail to understand the concept of posting in a public forum and in particular a forum based on Blender. You initiated a thread in a public forum yet you have neither the maturity nor the consideration to respnd in a civilized manner. At this point given your previous response I would no longer consider anything else you have to say as worthwhile.
Verbally abusive posters should be locked from the forums. The anger and outrage you expressed clearly indicate that it does matter to you. I would recommend you take your “I Felt Like It” attitude, combine it with your “Penis” comments and GET A GRIP ON YOURSELF. It might make you feel better:)
Wow, people talking down to valarking of all people!!??
I smell a pwning coming your way guys.
Anyway, it looks like you might have to post the “serious cat” pretty soon, valarking. I think it’s the only way to save what’s left of the thread now.
Yes, you feel I am the moron who is trying to interpret your “elastic” Vista meter. A rating of 2.4 is bleow medium and naturally 5.6 - 6 is “Way Off The Scale”. Again, is this a scale of 1 to 5 or 1 to 10??
Its an open ended scale, so as specs get higher its more plausible to get a higher score, but it isnt based an a 1-10 type of ruling
