Yes, this is Eevee with official barbershop_interior scene.
The ability to adjust the thickness and brightness of the scrollbar is definitely something Iâd like to see. It often gets lost in the background and is annoying.
YupâŠ
- Scroll bar experience is worse than what it used to be.
- So Area Split Widgets are gone⊠Why? Because they were helpful!
- Missing visual info on which render engine is used. Problems will arise when others come to play.
- Auto Offset Node button got stacked in the View menuâŠ
- Smooth/Flat Shading are out of fast reachâŠ
- Not only that Render actions are removed from Properties to the least used/visited menu slot/item also Viewport Render & Viewport Render Animation (ex OGL) are removed from all the bars and put away in the View menu settings.
- VSE seems as if instantly forgotten from any optimization (either UI/visual or code wise)
- Did any developer ever consider to LOCK TRANSFORMATIONS on âmeshlessâ/ âextra objectsâ (lamps, light probes, 3D cursorâŠ) when Overlays are turned off?!?
Yes, accidental transforms happen a lot when you donât see shit which is still present and responsive/interactive. - Will 3D cursor ever get the âpromisedâ orientation ability?
- Wires on all viewport engines are visually distracting to the point of being unusable (unless youâre using high DPI display).
- Where did the visibility option
went in todayâs build?
âŠ
Yes, i often forget that many just donât care or simply have hard issues with putting attention to details but nevertheless
This is how i feel whatâs been done with UI/UXâŠ
Sure, it might look clean in amateurish eyes & to an empty mind, but how would you feel, if IKEA ppl with a help of your grandparents did the interior design and cleaning round the house for you⊠At first it looks all nice and dandy when suddenly, thereâs underwear in the fridge (so you wonât stand naked in-front, thinking - watching what to snack for breakfast) and a toothbrush is stacked next to dishes so you donât forget to brush teeth after?!?
Ahhh⊠
Whereâs the wolf to eat me!
7 Likes
I can only say 2 things.
- Blender is free software : you donât pay for it (you can donate and thatâs your free choice) So donât expect same behaviour in development as from monsters like Autodesk (they however also like to mess things up lately)
- Blender is open source - so you can build your own version with your own UI design and keymaps as you like.
PS. And all is not so bad with 2.8 I donât like some features myself but thatâs how things work .
2 Likes
But these problems you mention, again, are still just adaptation pains. The Physics tab is only âa headache to navigateâ for as long as you donât know exactly where the settings you need are. Once you learn and get used to that, you know where they are and can go immediately to them, you no longer have to âlook for themâ. Likewise, once you know that the panel is scroll-able, it doesnât matter whether you can visually see a scroll-bar or not. Once you know that the Cloth Physics settings panel can be scrolled, for instance, itâs not something you have to worry will ever change the next time you use it, so that you need a scroll bar to let you know.
It is not âjudgmentâ, it is just a differing opinion about the UI changes.
Folks, you should definitely go out more often, get some fresh air and meet people time to time⊠
15 Likes
Sure. If youâre a programmer, rather than a 3D creator. This is always a kind of silly argument that is often used with OSS. Itâs like, âif you donât like this car design you can build your own versionâ. Yeah, sure I can, if Iâm an auto engineer with lots of free time rather than just a mere driver.
I must admit myself I cannot see some grand ergonomic redesign here. Thereâs a bunch of changes but itâs not (to me at least) coherent. For instance the icon de-design seems to be just because âother people are doing thatâ, as with the hideous post-Wndows 7 icons in Windows. Itâs almost like a bunch of middle aged executives are sitting there saying âmy kids have these smartphone things, if we make our stuff look like that itâll be groovyâ.
Of course we have the, âyou donât pay for it so take what you getâ argument. But then, if we donât use it thereâs no Blender and Blender Foundation doesnât exist, so itâs not that simple really is it?
Why they took away the Toolshelf will I suspect remain one of those great human mysteries which will fascinate historians in centuries to come.
The documentation exists tracking all along on the âwhyâ for the redesign. If you are happy with post 2.5 series, then you should let go of preconceptions you are holding onto and let William and jendrzych complete their UI work, as they were the ones to give you the 2.5 series UI.
We keep kicking that horse around, but no, nobody is just doing this to keep up with the Joneses. Design decisions are being made and even remade as they come across things that need to be fixed - and a LOT has to do with preparing for todayâs LMB Select Default roll out.
Tool Shelf is replaced by the Top Bar which actually frees the user up to get a lot done in a single window frame and lose less real estate. Panels will actually reside on the right side, and interaction with add-ons will be different since they plan on making it possible to set the visibility of the add-on panels per workspace - so if I am texture painting, I can have BPainter set up full on there, but if I switch to Modeling, I can have HardOps and BoxCutter there. In stable 2.79b, I have all of it, all of the add-ons present all the time depending on if they even respect the mode I am in. Clutter.
I was skeptical at first, but I took a breathe and then embraced the change. People are adverse to it - but dang it, I enjoy sculpting and painting again even without my own add-ons for my macros. Eevee enables me to preview what I am doing faster, for the most part letting me use my cycles node trees and letting me swap around HDRI from disk for look dev.
Not to mention GPencil is a new beast, and the UI has to be changed to fit into the rest of Blender, sometimes causing things to be reexamined as to where they belong and how things should work.
Iâd suggest subscribing to the mailing list, get over to the dev forum and look around, read a bit. They are working their asses off to do this. In contrast, download the old 2.49 and the 2.56 etc and open those up, look around. These are organic changes by design. William has a definite reason for everything but he is still listening to input as he adjusts to that input, Iâve read it in my emails over and over.
One doesnât have to recode the whole thing - get involved, offer input with a calm tone and amazing things happen. I have to be patient because eventually my own texture paint will get some real attention too.
2 Likes
Iâm sorry to be a bit tetchy but if I need to subscribe to a mailing list to read the justifications for it, something is wrong. The key thing for any design is to test it, which means having naive (in the sense of, not involved in the design process) users actually use your thing and give feedback both just by doing, and reporting their impressions. Because designers do not know how a thing will actually work in the real world until it is used.
That is what threads like this are doing. For instance my âtop barâ does not have all the things in it my 2.79 toolshelf had, and I find it strange that in a world of ever more hugey screens we are now suddenly concerned with screen real estate. I am not a wealthy man (barely above minimum wage in the UK) but I have two 2560x1440 main monitors plus a 1280x1024 auxilliary. I have space for a toolshelf, honest to God.
Just before posting this, I am feeling minor rage, again, at the new multi-object editing. More than one armature I keep having to go back to the Outliner, turn this on, switch it to Object MOde, go to the next armature, do the same thing, hide them again, because⊠I want to zero one armature of one character.
And if I hit A, Alt-R it resets EVERY armature, even if they are hidden with select disabled. This is plain ridiculous.
This thing does not need people to admit their own foolish inability to accept progress after reading a mailing list. It requires several iterations of feedback and redesign until it is ergonomic again.
1 Like
- that nasty blinking top status bar in edit mode, stubborn unwillingness of the developers to add normal display of the statistics info in viewport and so onâŠ
2 Likes
There is no single software that will make everyone happy. I work with Blender for 1,5 year, previously Iâve been using 3ds max since 2005 and I have to say Iâm happy with Blender. And Iâm even more happy to use 2.80 from around 2 months. I like working with it much more than with 2,79. Blander has evolved and Iâm pretty sure that not everyone will like it. But there is other software. If someone doesnât like it can switch to 3dsmax, Cinema, Maya, Lightwave, Sketchup or other. Donât get me wrong - Blender is far from being perfect software but many changes in Blender are here because of the community.
Nothing wrong - go get on the dev forum and get involved with the devs. Be polite and explain with examples, they are open to discussion. The artists at the institute are also filing bugs a lot, I see that they interact with the devs on these and things have been changing a lot based on input and the original design docs being revised as necessary.
You are pushing the boundaries using what they have only recently made possible, so I think they could benefit from your input.
1 Like
Further observationsâŠ
Itâs not that much of an UI issue (thatâs easy to adapt to), but the âlocation changesâ which soon become the issue with a work-flow. Itâs not only taking a click or two more, but traveling larger distances is where the Schrödingerâs cat gets killed quite easily (inside the flowing mind - attention is on vision following eyes, going from one corner to the other and back and forth for no special reason but to achieve already decided, predestined goal. This âmeantimeâ is what destroys many thoughts and its instances).
Itâs like a shopping mall strategy, where stuff is shuffled around for consumer to spend more time inside the shop, being distracted by other products (kitschy - colorful & bright, but secondary / minor value) then spending more than what it came in for.
Still, humanity wonders about the Waste in this world.
Takes a strong character and personality to not fall in hell⊠debt and happily passing it on the future gen. 
1 Like
yeah it is like the hotkeys, many hotkeys, specially many of the often used, are terribly placed, If I wasnt able to change some of them I would go mad, it is crazy, like, instead of concentrating on your work you have to focus on jumping around in the keyboard, same goes for interface, I do live blender, but while 2.8 have same awesome stuff it doesnât solve much of that unfortunatly 
1 Like
Sorry, but despite having some good feedback, this reads like âIf I have to put in effort for this free software, somethingâs wrongâ. Free software. As in, youâre not paying people for it. As in, if you want them to do something for you, perhaps a little effort is warranted.
AndI do mean your input is valuable. I can see that you have a valid issue described. However, like it or not, unless weâre paying for these guys - if we want changes (even good ones) itâs not unreasonable for us to put effort in.
3 Likes
" * Scroll bar experience is worse than what it used to be."
Itâs better than ever. Itâs not in your way, taking a significant amount of space, if you donât need it. Also, the properties donât start scaling/twitching/moving, when it suddently appears. This is great.
" * So Area Split Widgets are gone⊠Why? Because they were helpful!"
Now you can split areas on all four cornders instead of two.
So, you donât need to be reminded which corners are for splitting.
Also, looks cleaner without them.
This is great.
" * Missing visual info on which render engine is used. Problems will arise when others come to play."
You mean the top most setting in the RENDER tab, where it logically belongs?
The render engine switch is something you have to do ONCE per project at most, and usually not even once.
It does not deserve a top layer position.
" * Auto Offset Node button got stacked in the View menuâŠ"
Well, kind of agree. Kind of not.
For starters, it doesnât have to be a top layer setting. Not worth it.
But is it a view setting? kind of. It changes how you VIEW your node trees.
I donât agree with splitting the node editor to various node editors. Makes little sense to me.
They are all node editors, but for different things. So why not make that a âmodeâ of the node editor?..
" * Smooth/Flat Shading are out of fast reachâŠ"
They are faster to reach than ever.
With Left click select. Right click - Select flat or smooth. Done.
With right click select, the same menu is in âWâ keyboard shortcut.
So, all you have to do is quicly press âW, Sâ or âW, Fâ and you can change the shading in a millisecond.
This is vastly superrior to searching for it in the toolshelf. That always felt kinda awkward to me.
" * Not only that Render actions are removed from Properties to the least used/visited menu slot/item also Viewport Render & Viewport Render Animation (ex OGL) are removed from all the bars and put away in the View menu settings."
I agree.
Btw, I noticed that there is no actual âRenderâ button anywhere around. And that should maybe even be a top layer big button to smash. Now this we could talk to developers about.
" * VSE seems as if instantly forgotten from any optimization (either UI/visual or code wise)"
Report a bug, or give it time.
âDid any developer ever consider to LOCK TRANSFORMATIONS on âmeshlessâ/ âextra objectsâ (lamps, light probes, 3D cursorâŠ) when Overlays are turned off?!?â
Likely not.
Report a bug or give it time.
" * Will 3D cursor ever get the âpromisedâ orientation ability?"
The 3D cursor, indeed now has an orientation.
However, there should be some number boxes in the âNâ shelf to adjust that orientation⊠The only way it can be adjusted now, is by placing it on a rotated surface.
Report a bug or give it time.
" * Wires on all viewport engines are visually distracting to the point of being unusable (unless youâre using high DPI display)."
No idea what you are talking about.
I have a 1920x1080 screen.
Wires look better than ever. Could you give me examples of whatâs exactly worse about them?..
Maybe you are refering to obscured lines being too thin? Well, I donât mind that, but maybe that could be adjusted.
âWhere did the visibility option 
went in todayâs build?â
The âview/hideâ button is still everywhere where I expect to find it. What exactly is your issue?
Maybe they were developing something and temporarily removed it when it was built that time?.. I can only guess.
Personally, I think blender is at itâs best right now.
The UI makes a lot more sense. A lot of design errors and a mess of 2.5- 2.79 was cleaned up in this new UI.
Of course, itâs not perfect and itâs not finished, and we can always find things to critique, but I am very happy with where itâs going.
And also, that new âQuick favoritesâ menu is a complete win. Shortcut âQâ.
You can place any command or tool or checkbox into it, which solves all of the âThe button is not on the header!â complaints you have. Pure gold.
11 Likes
The main annoying thing that I myself find is the disappearing of the icons and gizmos (top lines in the 3d window) during editing, it is so distracting. I can get used to all kinds of stuff but this is too much of a mind buster.
It is not a good solution to remove tons of icons to show couple of coordinates and transformations deltas.
Agree.
Pablo did mention that this will probably be changed.
Great to know.
This is what I was referring to. It sounds like you were saying that the option to turn on and off autokey is hidden in a menu. Does it not?