I’m just trying to see if i’m missing something, or am thinking of this completely wrong, but anyway, here goes…
So, me and my girlfriend are arguing about this, here is an example to try and explain what im talking about. If something has (Thought) before it, then its what the person is thinking, if something has (Action) before it, then it is something the person did or said. Here we go.
Person 1: (Action) “I hate you.”
Person 2: (Thought) I have to make a decision…
Person 2’s choices: (Action) “I don’t like you either.” OR (Action) does nothing. (I realize that there are an infinite amount of choices that could be made here, but for this let’s just say there are these 2.
Person 2 chooses: (Action) “I don’t like you either.”
So, Person 2 is at fault for what they just said, but the fact that they even had to make this decision is person 1’s fault, therefore is it not person 1’s fault that this happened? OR
Person 2 chooses: (Action) Does nothing
Same as above, i believe that ultimately, person 1 is at fault for this, regardless of what decision person 2 made, whether it be the two choices above, or perhaps person 2 kills person 1, or maybe person 2 goes to Sweden, or maybe person 2 buys a pet Gorilla, or maybe person 2 becomes the director of a major motion picture. While all of those are unlikely reactions to person 1 saying “I hate you.” It is still thier fault that a choice even had to be made, therefore it IS person 1’s fault.
Am i wrong, or not? I may be missing something, but thats what i think. Please tell me what you guys think.
This scenario lacks one important factor, there’s no ‘fault’ in the first place. I can say I don’t like you, but it doesn’t mean I did anything wrong or made a mistake, etc.
Whatever the problem is, just make sure about one thing: SHE is ALWAYS right. well, as long as you make her think this.
Nay, the question is what person 2 did wrong.
If I’m guessing right I would say you are person 2. Maybe person 1 (‘she’, I believe) had a good reason to hate person 2 (‘you’, I’m still guessing). Perhaps person 2 did something very immoral, forgot her birthday again or got himself another nose peircing.
Interesting question. Person one started the arguement, but person absolved themselves of any innocence in joining in “the fray”. So to that end, they’re both wrong.
However no one that I know of says “I hate you” out of the blue. What did person two do to piss off person one? Or how did person one get so pissed off if person two didn’t do anything?
In many circumstances (but not all, you must defend yourself sometimes) if you can understand why person one is so pissed you might avoid a nasty conflict altogether.
Oh, sorry, i guess i did forget the most important part, and the whole point i was trying to make…sorry i did this late last night. Anyways, here is what was ultimately trying to be decided, i said person 1 made person 2 say “I don’t like you either.” But she says someone can’t make someone say something, while that is partially true, because person 1 does not get to decide how person 2 reacts, they dont actually make them do what they do, but the fact that they made person 2 have to make a decision means that they did make them do something, correct?
The natural reaction to someone saying I hate you is. “Yeah and I hate you…”
There is a bunch of factors that come into roll at this point. That depend on what the outcome is. These are the past, present and mood of both people.
If for instance:
person1 = angry and person2 = angry that equals argument
or
person1 = angry and person 2 = happy that equals an in the middle thing
or
person1 = happy and person2 = happy then that equals a joke of some sort.
The reaction of person 2 is very dependant on person1. Person1 reaction has a major impact on person2. Maybe not physically telling them what to say but mentally.
Heres a great example of this. When your in a classroom or an office, and you start to click your pen constantly when people are trying to work. You may not be telling them to get mad but from what you are doing it is just as worst as telling them to be angry and annoyed.
It is very easy to control someone through emotions.
Personal Responsibility. Person one can be any kind of jerk they want, they’re at fault for their own actions. Like wise if person two wants to be a jerk back then he’s at fault for his own actions as well.
No one can control another person, you can guess someones emotional readiness to a situation and manipulate them to a degree by taking advantage of the lack of emotional vs. logical separation in someone but the final action another person takes is always up to them ergo they reap what they sowed.
Often times situations are never black and white and fault lies with more than one party, but people need to take personal responsibility for their actions. If someone wrongs you and you wrong them back you can’t claim that they “made you do it”, regardless of your emotional state. It didn’t work when you were three, and it shouldn’t work now.
I suggest (Action Jimmy) “I love you”. If your girlfriend says I hate you reply, I love you, then she’ll be like what the flip? She’ll fel guilty and say she’s sorry. And always remeber two wrongs don’t make a right, but three lefts do.
I think they are both in the wrong (perhaps not “evil” wrong, but wrong as in stupid wrong… I hope somebody understands that :P), regardless of previous circumstances. Things one said I hate you, but thing two chose to not let the comment go, or to deflect it, or to even try to dissuade the other person, or to do anything that would be beneficial, and instead acted as immaturely as the other person and replied in kind, thus continuing whatever the problem was. If thing 2 was you, I would say you acted quit immaturely, and you are as much in the wrong as thing 1.
…oh my…it looks like ill have to completely change the scenario, if thats what you guys want. The point is that this DID NOT actually happen, i said it’s an example. I just wanted my question answered…but if you guys really want i’ll retype it and make the situation a completely different conversation, but that still wouldnt change my question of DID PERSON 1 MAKE PERSON 2 SAY THAT? i dont mean directly, person 1 did’nt get to choose what person 2 replied, but the point is that they did make them make a decision, therefore it is ultimately thier fault. correct?
Haha, same argument my girlfriend and her mom made about it, so…heres what you’re saying, you can’t make someone do something? did you not make them make a decision of what to do/say by saying that? yes you did, and yes, you can make people do stuff. You just made me do something, You made a post, i read it, and had to make a decision, do nothing about it, or make a post defending myself, or go kill thousands of people, or anything else, you MADE me make a decision. Did you just come here and make a random post for no reason at all? No, i made a post that made you make a decision after you read it to tell me what you think, or to not tell me what you think, the choice you made was not up to me, therefore i did not make you do exactly what you did, but i made you have to make a decision at all, therefore, i am at least 50% responsible for what you did. For example, if you did’nt make a post telling me what you think, i still made you make a decision, correct? And that means that i did in fact make you do something.
No: one should take responsability for his own actions and sayings at all times. Yes, even when you where provoked.
Jail is full of people who claim somebody made them do it. Don’t go there.
Keep in mind that you don’t need to answer. Sometimes if you are not clear on what you think about the subject then don’t answer. Or answer that you want to think about it.
Go to school, learn stuff. Read stuff (biographies preferable) so you can make up your own mind about things. Be your own man, people will respect you for it.
More specific “I don’t like you either.” is pretty vage. I bet you defenitly didn’t liked her saying that she doesn’t like you. So you got the two mixed up in a fast response, when actualy you ment to say:
“I don’t like you saying that to me.” “I don’t like that part of you, the part that hurts me, stop that!” But the way out you choose: hurting them back, is your own choice and not a wise one. I’m afraid she’s right.
Okay, I’m out of fortune coockies wisdom.
“And that means that i did in fact make you do something.”
Stop rambling. I’m always going to be doing something. And no, it has nothing to do with you. I respond to lots of topics, also ones not started by you, the element you is total irrelavant to the fact that I respond.
“you MADE me make a decision”
Thats the verb make twice in one sentance.
YOU made the decision. That was the topic. Not who made you make the dicision. Thats just smokescreen.
I make the diccision to respond and definitly how I respond. I make up my own mind of what I think of your statements and come with my own thoughts (or repeat what I learned somewhere). They are not related to you as a person (how can it? I don’t even know you) they are related to the memes your thoughts represent. I respond to the idea you posed.
Well yes we are in interaction, but it’s me who entered this site, so it’s me who choose to encounter this meeting. With or without you would not have altered what I would do.
And it would therefore be total mad if I (or someone else) would hold YOU responsable for what I did or write in this peace. How where you to control that in any way? How where you to know what I was going to say? And was I’m not going to say these things if you didn’t post? How where you to know?
You make your own decisions, the fact that you make decisions is called life, they have nothing to do with me, your mom, your girlfriend or her mom, the sea the air or your nose. It’s your brain making 100s decisions every second, knowingly or not. I suspect with you your brain only makes more decisions unknowingly then knowingly (well mine to, thats why my hands can type and I don’t hear the noise at my office), but that is something you can change to your favour with practice. Read stuff, Learn stuff, do less video games and watch less TV.
But start with this: When somebody hurts you, count to 10, then answer. Or even better, why answer to someone who wants to hurt you in the first place? What’s to gain? If you know what to gain, then you know what to answer, or at least don’t answer against what you hope to gain.
Ah, I see your following in Pres. Bush’s footsteps, twisting words to succeed in your agenda %| . Ya know, I have free will, provoking is not taking control of mind. So even in a lesser sense, you are notmaking anyone do anything, your asking for help (in a way) and as humans we offer our support cause wecare in some way or another.
I think I’ll go right a song in my online journal about the void of depression i’m falling in.
Emo wisdom
